Corine Cannon oral history, 2019.

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All right Miss Corine just say your name. Corine L. Cannon
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My name's David Staniunas. I'm records archivist at the Presbyterian Historical Society.
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Today's June 27 2019 and I'm with Corine Cannon.
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Corine, it's a pleasure to be here. Thank you.
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Would you begin by just telling us.
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A little bit about your early life where you were born your parents and family.
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I was born in North Carolina near Huntersville near
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North Carolina that's near Charlotte North Carolina.
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And I'm the daughter of Emmanuel C.
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Lytle and Rosie White Lytle
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And your father and your
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father and mother what was your father's profession.
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He was a farmer an entrpreneur
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and this was.
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This was nearby Kannapolis.
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It was near
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Huntersville near Charlotte.
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At that time Kannapolis was very young just being organized a young town was
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in fact a young community at that time.
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But my father was a farmer.
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He had about one hundred ninety six
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acres of land in Mecklenburg and
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Cabarrus counties. And it was a lot of work.
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I had a lot of relatives in that town, of
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our tree. We weren't Presbyterian at that time, my mother was
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originally from the Cedar Grove Presbyterian Church in Cabarrus Count, but
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my father was a
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AME Zion. He was very active in the AME Zion church and so we were brought up my siblings
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and I were brought up in two denominations.
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How does that work.
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It works well. Because once you're Presbyterian no matter where you go.
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You'll always have that Presbyterian-ism.
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And I hate to say "-ism" but it is is a part of
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you. And we had a large community
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at that time we called it the Lytle Grove community. The L in my name stands for Lytle, L Y T L E. And
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we had our school in our community which was Lytle grove school.
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I can remember when the Rosenwald School there was a
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high school that was in the south.
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The. Afro-American children put out.
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Roseenwald. I don't remember the initials but.
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I've forgotten what Mr. wrote the nation.
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It. Rosewald.
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I went to high school in the Cabarrus county in
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Concord North Carolina.
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Concord, Okay.
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Logan high school.
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At that time it was a young high school because that was something new for the
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Southerners.
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A lot of the communities didn't have high school.
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Yes.
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It was one in Logan it was a grade school.
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Yes.
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After high school.
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What were your future plans like.
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I planned to maybe go into college and get a doctorate degree and
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all this but other plans came up. I got married and I had a very good husband
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and a good marriage.
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I raised family. My family and quite a few other people's children
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I worked with children for many years.
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What was your husband's name.
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Esau, E-S-A-U.
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Cannon, C-A-N-N-O-N.
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Yes.
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He was an identical twin, he had a twin brother named Jacob Cannon, Esau and Jacob.
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They were named Jacob and Esau.
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Mm-hmm
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That's a heavy handle on if you're an identical twin named Esau.
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Yeah. Just carrying the name. If you read the stories it makes you remember them.
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Yeah.
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Did that affect. His personality or demeanor.
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You think.
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Carrying that weight.
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Yeah.
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Well, it wasn't too heavy but everybody knew the Cannon twins. Yeah I did.
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Yeah.
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Jacob and Esau. What was what was Esau's profession.
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He worked in textiles, at the Cannon Mills.
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So now we're at the Cannon Mills.
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We're back to Cannon Mills.
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So you were married and you and Esau moved to Kannapolis.
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Yes.
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You said you raised.
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Your own family and many other family members.
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Many other children. I worked with the.
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Kindergarten department in the churches.
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At that time a lot of parents had to go to work they'd bring their kids, children by my
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house. I used the church which is next door
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to me. As a kindergarten.
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Quite a few kids That went through my hands.
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And. The.
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Church that you were a member of.
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Covenant Presbyterian Kannapolis.
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And just so I know.
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What decade we're in at this point.
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When you when did you and Esau move to Kannapolis.
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We got married. November 19, 1938.
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We moved to Kannapolis on November 20th 1938.
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Early that morning by eleven o'clock.
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What was that moving day like.
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Well taking my suitcase out of the car.
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Putting it in the car.
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Yeah. You were traveling light.
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Traveling light. We were building a house, we had one room completed so we didn't go in
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the other completion and on that same.
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could continue. It may have been.
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I lived there 18 months and moved across the street district
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where there was there was left of his home house.
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They Cannon home house. I moved across the street.
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I've been there ever since I've been in that same house.
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The house was completed in May 1940.
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The Cannon mills.
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The 30s and 40s.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but my impression of the period is that during that time a lot
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of the mills from the north.
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In. Massachusetts in particular were kind of transferring
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operations to the south.
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To.
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To avoid using union labor in the north and to
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exploit the kind of underpaid wage level of
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Black labor in the south.
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What was life like for Esau in the Cannon Mills.
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We didn't have the union a union.
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The Cannon Mill property was owned by private people at that time.
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Mostly by the Cannon family and the
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Dayvaults and other people because it wasn't until about 30 years ago to
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him but before we ever had a city,
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it was always just a community. Cannon Mills was at one time one of the largest textile companies
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in the nation.
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During this time. And there were.
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Thousands of people working in three shifts and.
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The chances for African Americans at that time weren't very good.
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Because they had to take menial work, that wasn't productive.
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In fact I was the first African American woman to ever work in a productive job
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in Cannon Mills.
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I was going to ask. We have an oral history taken with
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Katie Cannon from the 80s where she lifts you
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up as.
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She tells a little bit about your story as.
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One of the first African-American women.
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I was the first.
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You were the very first. And you worked what was your job.
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Well I work in the spinning department and unless you know what I'm talking
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about but I ran the machine or a machine to
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it.
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To get the yarn ready to spin that made the material for the sheets and the linens that
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were being made at that time.
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How long did you work there.
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Well in fact I was late getting there.
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Because of the way the situation was you know.
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And I worked I had all of my children were here
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and
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I started working in 1963. And I worked and I had my mother with me
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and my children. I just I didn't make quite 15
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years right at 15 years I worked .
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Regular. But I never did.
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I never did it really quit.
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I just told them I'd be back when the situation.
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When my mother passed and then before I got back but other things.
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They were all getting in school. Everyone got into college. I'm
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getting a minimum wage increase.
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I got it right when I got the last one in a car
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for college.
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Yeah. Tell me.
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I don't know the birth order ages of your children.
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Can you run it down real quick.
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What's the name of your oldest child.
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The oldest child is James. Ernest.
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Cannon, he is the granddaddy of Nicholas Scott. Nick.
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He's the grandfather.
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He has quite a few others, grands.
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One of his youngest grandsons graduated this past May from Howard University.
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Javen Carter Cannon
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Congratulations are in order.
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Who's next after James.
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Esau Levon. L-E-V-O-N
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Thank you. Who's next after.
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Sarah Elizabeth.
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Cannon Fleming.
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Who's next after her
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Doris Corine Cannon Love
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And so Katie Geneva is fifth.
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Oh I forgot Katie!
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Oh. That's OK.
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After Sarah was Katie Geneva Cannon.
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OK she's fourth.
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Yeah, and then Doris.
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And. They met and a foster daughter.
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Sylvia Moon Wynn
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W-Y-N-N. And John
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Wesley John Wesley.
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John Wesley is another foster child?
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No that's my child.
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Oh goodness gracious.
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Yes. And then.
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Jerry Lytle.
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Is that. Yeah.
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There is certainly a special place in heaven for mothers
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and mothers of seven children.
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Have some special room there.
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What was it. What was it like.
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How far apart was the spread between James and Jerry.
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Eight years ten years twelve years to that.
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Twenty five years.
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Jerry was born, when James was already married.
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Goodness gracious.
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After high school dear James Ernest went
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into service, military service. He married while he was in
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the service.
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So Katie grew up right in the middle of this big
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She used that for an excuse.
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Excuse for what.
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Well you know anytime, It's not my fault I was in the
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middle I didn't get as much time. She said she didn't get as much time as
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everybody else. She told that in school.
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What else did she say.
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I didn't know that she wasn't getting the time she was supposed to.
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But she did use it.
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She said that Katie.
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That Sarah and Doris got more attention.
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We have a very happy fan.
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This is my, that's Miss Winn over there.
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What was school like for the Cannon children.
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Well I think it was very good for them
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They all went to. That was my husband's main reason and purpose for living was to educate
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those children.
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To see that they got an education. Because he was not that blessed.
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His parents were sharecroppers.
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And if you I know you read about how hard it was for a lot of the sharecroppers.
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I was blessed to be in just a little better circumstances
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than. My family was because they were landowners
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and I like I say entreprenurs working from the age 7
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something.
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We were brought up being salesepersons.
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For about 50 years I was referred to as the
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famous Avon lady in both counties. I sold quite a bit of Avon.
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Katie Geneva went to the public school?
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She went to public schools.
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George Washington Carver High School in Kannapolis.
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And after that she went to Barber-Scotia. And after that she went to ITC.
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She was blessed, she got scholarships, she went cum laude, she was
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a straight-A student.
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And from that she went to Union in New York got her doctor's degree there.
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When.
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When she went off to Barbara Scotia What was that like for you.
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Well I looked forward to it my great my grandparents my grandmother.
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Her great grandparents were one of the first graduates.
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It was Scotia seminary at that time.
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Yeah.
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And so it was like a landmark for us.
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In fact it was just about 12-15 miles from our house so they were
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expected to go there because it was.
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With that many children and their ages being so close together.
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Kate was born in 1950. Doris was born in 1951,
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Sara was born in 1948.
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So that was three right together. But Miss Winn, Sylvia, went to Spelman.
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That's what brought her to Atlanta.
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They all graduated from Carver.
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So you were close enough when Katie was at Barbara Scotia to stay in
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touch a little bit. Or was it one of those things where you get a little bit away from
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your parents just in order to get freedom.
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I saw them about every week. If they weren't there they were home
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with me. Can boxes of food.
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Pies and cakes and things.
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And so Katie was there.
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I guess between 68 and 72.
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Yeah. Sara graduated 70, Katie was next
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There is. There was a.
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Recording I think done in 2008.
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Where the church interviewed Katie about the experience
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of being a college student at Barber Scotia on the
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4th of April 1968 when Martin Luther King was assassinated.
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Did you and she talk about that experience.
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You know I mean she would have been a college freshman and.
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Yes she enjoyed being at Barber Scotia.
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She was Miss Barber Scotia for one year.
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She did a lot of different things.
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She talks about having a kind of.
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Political awakening.
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She was there during the time of.
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That Martin Luther King's.
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Movement. Yeah.
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With a lot of changes going on.
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Was there other kind of political or cultural ferment
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Kannapolis at the time.
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Oh yes.
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Tell me more.
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Everything was segregated for us and naturally
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there'd be policitcal problems. There was a lot of tension in the school
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I'm I'm also from the south by my high school did
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not integrate until 68 so 14 years after Brown v.
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Board.
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My mother's high school didn't integrate until 1970.
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Well. That kept us through a lot
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of things they were not exposed to.
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The African American children.
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Tell me more.
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Well, it was separate and very unequal. I think that's what we said instead of separate and equal. Very unequal.
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No comparison to a lot of white places.
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Kannapolis itself is an
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almost entirely Black community?
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Well yes and see all of the schools all the churches all of the properties.
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All the properties were owned by the Cannons. But
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it was Since we did not have a union.
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I'm going to try to make it plain for you to see.
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The parental care was there and it wasn't like you may be
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thinking it is different when I say parental.
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The schools there were times
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during before integration. The school system
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of Cabarrus County and Kannapolis city schools.
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Have never been together. See Kannapolis is in Cabarrus County.
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But there's a Cabarrus County school system.
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And then. But.
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J.W.
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Cannon was the older Cannon. Charles Cannon was really the one
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that was in charge of the churches and the schools
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there. And anytime that money was needed rather than having you with
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ever the Union, at one time Charles Cannon paid the teachers' salary. So
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all the schools and all the churches the mainline churches were on Cannon property.
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At one time.
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So Charles Cannon's philanthropy for the schools and churches
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is in lieu of paying union wages?
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Not in lieu of where you got your wages but they were minimum.
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Livable but minimum.
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And the other needs.
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You could always depend on the Cannons.
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This. Is probably gonna sound like.
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He died in.
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April, I can't think of the year But when he died the Cannon
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Foundation supported
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all churches but particularly the Presbyterian church.
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And that persists today.
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Yeah it persists today one of the.
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His grandson Robert Hayes Jr.
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is in charge of the Cannon Foundation.
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I suppose I'd like to circle back to Covenant Presbyterian Church in Kannapolis.
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Covenant Presbyterian Church is 60
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years old I believe this October.
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When you would take the family to church what was that experience like.
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I live next door to the church. And
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there were woods in this area.
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This church was built by the Presbyterian
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Church, Southern Presbyterian Church of Concord.
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There was a couple elders that built this church in this community.
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From the First Presbyterian Church in
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Kannapolis. Bob. R. M. Efrid, E-F-R-I-E-D was in charge.
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And so it was a it was a mission church of the PCUS.
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Yes.
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And it was organized.
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Around 60 years ago. And my husband had to clear the lot off to build the church. We built it. Even
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in a communities. The community where it is is called Fisher Town.
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A community from Kannapolis.
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We're not incorporated yet.
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Fisher Town.
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Fisher Town.
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Fisher Town community.
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I live in Fishtown in Philadelphia.
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Very industrious little place
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And so so you. Your family was members of a new church.
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Effectively a new church development in the 50s
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Very prosperous and growing because it was a growing community Covenant
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United Presbyterian, we were United had to we get out.
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We left the Southern presbytery.
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We were organized by Catawba Presbytery
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So you left the South during Catawba Presbyterian
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one of the All Black govenrning bodies
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That was one of the larger presbyteries in the eastern part of North Carolina
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Katie was ordained in Catawba Presbytery is that right. Do I
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have that correct.
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She was the first African American female.
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And the last person that was ever ordained in Catawba Presbytery was Jerry and
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we made history all along.
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You know the advertisement says the first to go to college and the first to drop out.
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When was Jerry ordained in Catawba.
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What year was it.
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That's changes
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or rupture.
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When was there no more Northern or Southern churches. No.
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It's 1983 was reunion.
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(sotto voce) I'm 99 years old I can't remember
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So
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the Cannon family has had an imprint on the life of the presbytery
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of that one all Black governing body.
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And Jerry's already been a moderator of Charlotte Presbytery.
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And he is on quite a few other committees.
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In fact I worked with Presbytery too.
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I've been to General Assembly about 8 times.
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Oh what was your first General Assembly.
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My first General Assembly that I attended was in 1961
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[1969] at San Antonio, Texas.
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What were the major issues that first General Assembly.
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The same as today. We had racial
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issues. We had sexual issues.
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We have some of the issues that we study and worry about now in the church are the same ones that
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we have always had.
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A lack of money in places and
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the budget and those were the kinds of issues that we had then are still here.
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Do you think that the way the church.
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Addresses. Those issues has changed in 50 years.
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Are we doing any better.
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Are circling around.
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[silently declines]
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Have you seen the General Assembly address those issues differently
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1961 compared to like 1981 to 2009.
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Yes I do. I see they address it differently.
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But I would say I really don't know. I can't speak to that person.
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I don't see much change in what we do. We
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losing. Really. But I've been here a long time.
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That we were losing members. But I know now we are losing a lot of our members.
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So you've been to four general assemblies.
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I've been to eight.
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I'm sorry eight.
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I've worked on different levels.
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Committees.
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You know the Board of National Missions at 475 Riverside Drive, I sat on that committee. Attended all the meetings we had over there.
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OK so you were on the governing committee of the Board of National Missions. And
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you said you've been a commissioner as well.
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Yes I've been a commissioner about three or four times.
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Yeah. What was the most interesting committee you were on.
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Cesar Chavez, you know the farmer.
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Cesar Chavez.
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Yeah yeah. I was on that committee, I met with those people.
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That was it. It was in.
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Without a those in San Antonio.
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Maybe 71.
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I'm looking for it.
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Let's see
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San Antonio was 1969.
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And there was a where urging that I would go.
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I was a commissioner in Chicago. And I was in Baltimore.
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And I went to Atlanta for one. I think that's the only place I would do that one.
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I came to Atlanta when the Southern and Northern were going together
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You were at reunion.
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I was at reunion.
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So you met with Cesar Chavez in 1970 in Chicago.
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Yeah. Yes I believe that's right.
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Yeah. I have my notes and diaries.
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That would be great. We would we're very committed to.
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Helping preserve. The story of your family.
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And if you have.
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Notes and personal papers available.
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I would love to bring them in to make them accessible.
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If that's just a blanket offer.
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To.
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Do you remember anything about the committee's work with Cesar Chavez and the United
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Farm Workers.
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It was the standard assent we give in all our committees. I don't know really.
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If there was change from our committee. I mean personally I'm talking personally.
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There might have been other things that I didn't know about.
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But I know we always had those issues.
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The farm workers you know everybody was being
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oppressed. That time. It was being brought up at the General Assembly.
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But was there a difference made I can't say how I wouldn't dare say.
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That.
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I keep talking about the 1970 journals because
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we have.
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We have motion picture footage of the 1970 assembly.
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And there were very extensive interviews done with youth delegates.
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Yeah, YADs I believe we called them
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Yeah yeah yeah. And so the church was very much interested in
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kind of addressing the concerns of the youth of the day.
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And. So it's it's kind of a focus for us especially since we're coming up on
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50 years since.
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2020.
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Baltimore. Like you say we're going to be dealing with many of the same issues the church
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was facing back in 1970.
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Hearing that the church was attempting
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to bear witness to the struggles of farm workers in 1970.
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It. Seems to have historic resonance today.
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Folks migrating north and being detained in.
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Concentration camps. Children.
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You've been involved in the church and many levels.
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You've been a commissioner in the General Assembly.
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How long have you been involved with the National Black Presbyterian Caucus.
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The first time I heard I guess over 61.
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Usually you know when we had General Assembly you know it was always a day or so we would
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have a meeting.
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Jerry was in Philadelphia I believe.
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What year was that.
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The last time it was in Philadelphia.
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I know of.
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It mighta been 1989.
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That sounds right We all went up to Philadelphia. That's when Jerry Cannon was at presbytery
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So. You've been involved with the Black Caucus since 1989.
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Yeah I've been to a lot of the meetings since that time
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What brought you into the caucus.
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What does that do for you.
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The same thing I said. If it is good, I don't mind being involved in it.
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That can just say what brought me into it but I've been in the Presbyterian church active
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since 1940.
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Yeah yeah.
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So it's not a matter of choosing You've been chosen.
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It's just me being asked to serve on committees.
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Never did know how to say no.
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And
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we used to during the Presbyterian women United Presbyterian Women
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used to help a lot with the publication and not the publication of it.
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But the distribution in selling it subscriptions for
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Concern and Horizons all our different books.
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And the national meeting at Purdue at one time I went to Purdue every year I
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haven't been to the national meeting since 1988.
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The other day from the first meeting we had was
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at Maryville Tennessee and.
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I didn't go then for about eight or ten years every year after that when we started
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in every year and then every two years like that I used to always try to get to the
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meetings.
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Get other people encourage other people to go and read our.
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Presbyterian Women's magazine.
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I still do.
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Do you have any thoughts about the transition from Catawba
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Presbytery as an all black governing body into
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the post 1983.
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Having just geographic presbyteries and fully integrated presbyteries
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Well that's what you call progress you don't stop progress then there's
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the next level. You miss a lot that you leave behind.
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You don't want to miss your present blessings because you're holding on to the past
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I had the same question about their councils for a lot of different people of
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varying opinions.
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You get You miss a whole lot of the good things that's coming to you in the future by
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holding on. This too shall pass. Enjoy
speaker
it while it's passing and go on to the next level. It's not gonna be the same.
speaker
You don't always have the same people.
speaker
Now that we've entered the realm of.
speaker
Philosophy.
speaker
Of do you have any special pieces of advice for.
speaker
The youth of Black Caucus for the youth of the Presbyterian Church.
speaker
That's a deep subject. I think it is a great need.
speaker
I think there's a whole lot. I really feel like and I shouldn't say it because I'm not
speaker
there. I mean I'm just speaking my personal opinions about these things because there's
speaker
things going on I don't really know about.
speaker
But seemingly the training that I got in
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that my children got as Presbyterians.
speaker
I don't see that same training.
speaker
Being. Now.
speaker
Well people always used to send their children to church camps.
speaker
Ghost Ranch. I don't hear of anybody going to Ghost Ranch.
speaker
What was the place in New York, we always at my church we always sent.
speaker
Did you send people to Stony Point?
speaker
Stony Point, yes my son in law would fill up his van and take the crowd for a week.
speaker
Well we go to New York with kids with
speaker
children under 18.
speaker
We started to get children in the church who wanted to come to Sunday school every Sunday.
speaker
The ones who were in the youth choir They either went to Stony Point Ghost Ranch.
speaker
What someplace said they were running the people too.
speaker
I remember one year they had so many who wanted to go would go in and the restriction was
speaker
that couldn't go. I think they had to be a senior in high school.
speaker
Something like that.
speaker
And I had children who had tears in their eyes wanted to go who worked in [Spelman] and
speaker
gotten the money and I got a notice from the lady that was running the place at
speaker
Stony Point if I sent them and they weren't qualified then
speaker
I sent them anyway.
speaker
And I got complimented for sending them they
speaker
said they were well-behaved. Smart. And they are still in the Presbyterian Church.
speaker
So the experience of going to a camp as a youth was formative.
speaker
So whatever whatever you know we had the youth conferences.
speaker
That still might be happening. But I don't see the people in my area around getting
speaker
training too much. Like I say just about that interest.
speaker
Yeah that training is there is always.
speaker
I call it "ism". But it's always there.
speaker
The Ism is always with you.
speaker
Oh yeah. You do somethings that.
speaker
If you're born with it and it's the right thing you can always always it'll always be
speaker
there
speaker
That sounds like a good place to end for now.
speaker
Thank you for your time Corine.
speaker
I hope this is.
speaker
Not the last time you get to speak with us.
speaker
I did.
speaker
I like a good conversation.
speaker
OK.
speaker
Thank you.

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Details

Title: Corine Cannon oral history, 2019.
Description: Interview of Corine Cannon conducted in Atlanta, Ga., June 2019
Creator: Cannon, Corine, 1919-
Date: 2019
June 2019
Type of resource: moving image
Genre: oral histories
Form: born digital
Extent: 1 digital video file (mp4)
Subject names: Cannon, Corine, 1919-
Topics: African American Presbyterians.
Presbyterian women--United States.
Geographic subjects: Kannapolis (N.C.)
United States.
Atlanta (Ga.)
North and Central America--United States--North Carolina--Cabarrus--Kannapolis
North and Central America--United States--Georgia--Fulton--Atlanta
Rights status: IN COPYRIGHT - NON-COMMERCIAL USE PERMITTED; http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC-NC/1.0/
Physical location: ARCHIVES 19-0701; Presbyterian Historical Society, Philadelphia, PA
Related item: National Black Presbyterian Caucus documentation, 2019.--http://prestohost68.inmagic.com/Presto/content/Detail.aspx?ctID=Y2RiNWNk...
Identifier (local): CorineCannon-720
PID (Persistent Identifier): islandora:150680

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