Ervin Beck oral history, 2015.

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speaker
Hello, Ervin Beck speaking.
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Hello, Mr. Beck.
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This is Julian, the grad student,
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doing research about community
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school.
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Yeah hi. Just a minute.
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I want to go to a different phone.
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Sure. Take your time.
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Just a minute.
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Okay. Hello, Julian.
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Hello, Mr. Beck. How are you doing
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this morning?
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I'm just fine, actually.
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And I.
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I have wanted to clarify this for a
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while, as is all of Indiana
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and Eastern Standard Time
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or only part of it.
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Do you know?
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There may be a zone close
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to Chicago or close
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to Cincinnati
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sometimes.
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I'm not sure about that.
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I think maybe Chicago is
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in a different zone.
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Okay.
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But most of Indiana
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is in Eastern
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standard and our time changes
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Sunday night.
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Okay. Good to know.
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So, Mr. Beck, before you get started
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with the interview, I was I was
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wondering if you had any questions
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for me about about my research
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project.
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Oh you're doing a master's thesis?
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That's correct.
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And your advisors themselves
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are graduates of community school.
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Is that what you said?
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Yeah. Two women who graduated
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in 1973.
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Okay well, it was about ten years
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after I was there.
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Yeah.
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So no I know what a master's thesis
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is. I'm a
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folklorist, so I know what oral
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history is, and
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it's a good topic.
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I hope to be able to read it
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sometime.
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Yes, of course.
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So before you get started, I'll just
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say two things really briefly.
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The first is that,
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as you know, I've drafted up a list
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of questions
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based on what I know about the
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school or what I've read about it in
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the past. But my questions
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are not exhaustive.
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So if there's anything that you
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think is important that you want to
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tell me that the questions
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don't cover, you should feel free to
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go off in different directions.
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And also, if there are any questions
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that you don't want to answer for
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any reason, that's that's, of
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course, totally fine.
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And the second thing that I'll say
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is that when I finish
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the interview, I'll type of a
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transcript of it and send it off to
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you so you can make any changes
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that you would like to make for for
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any reason.
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And at that time, I'll also send you
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a copyright form to sign
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if you want to do that and have the
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interview archived.
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Okay. So as I understand
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it, you are now, you
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will be putting what I
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say into a computer
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in text form. Is
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that right?
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So what I'm doing, so what I'm going
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to do now is make an audio
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recording
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and then I or someone else
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will will physically type up the
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transcripts based on the recording.
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Oh, I see.
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So you still have to type them.
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Yeah. And unfortunately,
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as you say.
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Maybe, you had some magical
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equipment.
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Okay, go ahead.
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I don't have any questions.
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Maybe I will add
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some things as we go along.
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But whatever
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you have for me, fine.
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Great.
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So, Mr. Beck, the first question I
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have is for the record.
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Could you please tell me your full
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name, the years you worked
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at the community school, the
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positions you held there,
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your current profession, and the
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state in which you currently live?
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Okay. My full name is Ervin
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Beck Jr., and that's
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spelled with an E and a V,
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E R V I N.
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Beck, B E C K,
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Jr.
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I live in Indiana, Goshen,
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Indiana.
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I taught at Goshen
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College and most
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of my career 30
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some years.
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I'm Emeritus
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Professor.
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I taught English and
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folklore at Goshen
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College.
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Goshen College has a liberal
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arts college sponsored by the
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Mennonite Church.
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I'm a mennonite
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and what else? Oh when I- Alright,
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Phyllis, my
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wife and I, Phyllis taught
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at Community School.
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That's what we called it anyway,
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from 1961 to
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1964.
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Both of us were full time.
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We had no children.
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We went there after
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graduating from Goshen College
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and teaching for two
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years in high school
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in Indiana.
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And then we went to
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Tehran to teach at
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Community School at the high school
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level, junior high and
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high school levels.
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Thank you. And Mr. Beck,
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my second question is, can you tell
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me how you were recruited to teach
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at community school
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and whether you were employed
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directly by the Presbyterian Board
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of Foreign Missions or by or by the
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school itself?
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1961,
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when we went to Tehran,
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was in the middle of the
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Vietnam War.
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People our age were being
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drafted.
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Mennonites were conscientious
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objectors
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and sought alternate
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work, usually
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service
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in the United States or
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abroad.
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Actually, Phyllis and I were
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certified schoolteachers, so we
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were not subject to the
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draft.
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But a lot of our friends were
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going to different
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service assignments,
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and we felt that we should too.
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And so we looked around
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for
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places
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to do that kind of do that alternate
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work.
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And a
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friend of ours from Goshen College
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had gone to Community School.
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His name was Paul Wenger
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and taught there for
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a couple of years.
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And when he was finished
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or in his last year,
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he sent us a letter
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encouraging us to consider
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Community School.
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And
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the
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countries accessible to
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us through our own churches'
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board were all in Africa.
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And we didn't want to go to Africa,
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but the more we read about Iran,
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the more interesting it sounded.
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So we applied
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and were accepted
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or hired.
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I think we had applied
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through
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the Mission Board, the Mission and
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Service Board of the Presbyterian
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Church, but
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we were paid for by
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community school.
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So the
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Community School was a
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self-supporting project
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and under
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the umbrella of the Presbyterian
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Church, as you know.
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And so the official work
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was done by the Presbyterian Church.
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But then we were
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employed by the School
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and paid by the School.
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Thank you.
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So my next question is
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what did you hope to achieve during
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your tenure teaching at Community
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School? What were your goals as a
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teacher, pedagogical or
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otherwise?
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Well,
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as I said, our our
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primary motivation was
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genuinely to
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do something
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good and useful
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in the world to combat
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the horrible things
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that were going on.
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At least that's what we said.
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And that was the topicial,
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and the
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timely reason
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for us to go.
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We were also young and
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knew that
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once we had children, this wouldn't
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be possible.
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So it seemed to be the right time to
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do that.
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And frankly, if this tradition
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in the Mennonite church,
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I go somewhere and
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help out,
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that may be naive, but that's the
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way it is.
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And it continues through Mennonite
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Central Committee and mission boards
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and so on. We're much like the
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Quakers, and so almost everybody is
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expected to do that.
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And certainly at that time that was
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the case.
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So there was a lot of,
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I guess I could say, social
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pressure, but we
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were
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eager to find out what the world was
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like, travel, and
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we thought we were going to be
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living in a mud hut with
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dirt floors.
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That was okay with us.
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So we were
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maybe a little bit reckless or
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foolhardy, I don't know.
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But anyway, we went and
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never regretted it, not for one
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minute.
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So my next question is,
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how would you describe the ideals
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that that the school itself was
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trying to instill in the students?
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And since the school was established
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originally by the Presbyterian Board
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at the time you were teaching their
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Community School, have have a strong
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Christian feel.
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Yes, we felt perfectly
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at ease in that situation.
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We went not, we were
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called by the Presbyterian
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Church "short-term missionaries."
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As you know, that's the category
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under which we were recruited and
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our application was handled.
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So we had to be Christian, have
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a Christian statement of faith,
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but we didn't go as
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missionaries.
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We had no illusions
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that we
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would be able to so-called
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convert people,
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even if that was possible in a
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Muslim country.
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The school was started not as
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a mission school, as you know.
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It was started to serve
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families of missionaries,
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children of missionaries, and
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mainly an expatriate
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enrollment.
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So we went with
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service, motivations
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and Christian service.
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Sure, it was
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more than a nominally Christian
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school, but it was very
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tolerant and embracing and
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encouraging of other
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religions, all religions.
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I don't think
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kids of other religions
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felt
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forced to conform.
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I think they felt accepted
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and and their traditions
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honored in the school.
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The school did require
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some Bible study,
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and there were optional chapels, as
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you know.
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But it was not, I would say, forced
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on students
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perhaps to comment more on
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that if you have questions.
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But yes, we felt immediately
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at home there. The
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long term staffing of
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American and English and
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Filipino and other
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expatriates were very friendly.
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Students are wonderful.
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So
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what else would you like to know
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along those lines?
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I guess if you, if you want to say
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something more about, about the
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chapel services and other religious
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curriculum,
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that would be interesting.
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You
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know, I don't remember a lot.
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We had convocations, which
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were secular
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or cultural or generally
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spiritual, but not Christian.
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I remember especially the
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international days and so
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on.
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I remember one chapel
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by a
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mission-motivated person
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that I thought was a little bit
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high pressure. But that didn't
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happen very often,
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and the students who went in
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were free to go or not to go.
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They had, I don't know
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what, I don't remember
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what the requirements were in terms
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of Bible and religious studies.
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I think they had to take a course
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called Religions of the World or
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something like that taught
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by Mr. Brewster.
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And we had a wonderful chaplain,
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Mr. Fennelly,
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who was
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a good humor and very broad
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minded, very liberal
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Christian minister.
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I was asked one time
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to teach a junior
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high course in
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the parables.
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I did a lousy job, but
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those are interesting stories that
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anybody can
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appreciate.
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That was the closest I came to
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being related with anything
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specifically
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religious.
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It didn't go very well
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because I wasn't used to teaching
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such things. It
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was okay.
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Thank you.
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So let's move on to talking about
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the curriculum.
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I'm curious what courses
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you taught when you were at
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Community School and if you could
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describe what you remember about
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their curricula?
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I think every year I taught
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freshman course
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in ancient and medieval
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history,
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not modern European
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history, but ancient and medieval
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history. I think the first semester
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was ancient and the second
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semester was medieval,
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and I also always taught
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a course in British literature
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for seniors.
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I also was a sponsor
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of a newspaper
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called Student Prince.
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Do you have access to those
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newspapers?
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I don't, unfortunately.
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That's too bad because
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we had a very good paper
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and everybody
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was amazed that we could get
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it out as often as we did.
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And it really
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was a good high school paper.
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The problem was that there was
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no good printing facility
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available, and we had Mr.
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Ali who was an agent
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for a printing shop, and
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they composed the paper
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letter by letter.
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Picking up with a pincer or I guess
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every letter and putting in a row.
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And so we had horrible,
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horrible text
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proofreading, but the paper
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was very good. There must be a
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collection of those somewhere,
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and that would
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give you absolutely the best
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chronicle of what the school
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was like. It would be too bad
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if you did not have those.
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Now, I used to have one,
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but I went to a reunion,
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Community School reunion, and gave
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it to somebody.
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Anyway, I don't know how long that
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continued, but there would be,
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I think, every two weeks, or at
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least every month
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of file for three years,
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1961 to 1964
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somewhere.
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Maybe Mr. Irvine would have it.
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I don't know.
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I don't know what kind of records
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were kept except for mission
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records.
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And the mission records wouldn't
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tell you much about the school.
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Right.
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My wife taught lower
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level English, and
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what else did she teach?
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Oh, you had to teach everything.
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One time I taught physical science.
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One time my wife taught it
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and so on, depending
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on who they could recruit or not
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recruit.
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But basically, I taught ancient and
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medieval history and the British
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Lit.
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The curriculum was very American.
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That's what everybody wanted.
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American education.
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Of course, the textbooks were
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American, and they tended
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to be college
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level textbooks.
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Somebody
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who graduated
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in English, for instance,
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apparently ordered sets
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of books that they had read in
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college.
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Some of them were not not
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appropriate at all.
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So we have a textbook problem.
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There was not money really
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to buy new textbooks.
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We had to use what was there
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and sometimes what was there was
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not too desirable.
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We had a two volume
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British Lit text, which
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was just fine,
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but no problem there.
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But for novels or plays
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in addition, it
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was pretty random.
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So I don't know how rational
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the curriculum was
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when it was originally drawn up and
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it depended on who was teaching.
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So we had books and
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teachers.
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I think I taught British Lit
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very well.
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It was amazing that I could teach
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that literature to those students,
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many of whom of course, were not
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native speakers.
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We always said one
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third of our students were
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Americans,
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one third were Iraqi
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Jews, and one third
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were from the rest of the
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international community.
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So that two thirds of our students
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tended not to be native speakers,
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but they they learned English pretty
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well. We had a few struggling
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students, but they worked
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hard. We made big assignments
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and we're very demanding.
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As I look back at it and
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I think they got a good
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education, especially
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if they went to American
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or English universities from
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there.
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That's British Lit now.
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Ancient and medieval history, I'm
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less
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pleased with that.
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But again, I was bound by
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the books we had.
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Ancient history, we used
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Plutarch's Lives, believe it
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or not, in Plutarch's Lives of
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the Greeks and the Romans.
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Well, it was wonderful.
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Those are wonderful texts.
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But it's, for instance,
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Iranian history from the Greek
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point of view,
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which I
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wasn't smart enough to
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critique.
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And then I took a course
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at the University of Tehran and
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and we studied the Greek history
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from the Iranian point of view.
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So that was very interesting.
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Anyway, I think
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I did have a textbook that had some
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ancient history
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in it, but the really
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interesting material
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came from Plutarch,
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wonderful Greeks and Romans,
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and of course, brought in
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Iranian history different
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times.
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I don't know. Somebody I think
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taught Iranian history.
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I didn't.
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And the medieval history
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lesson, again, from a textbook.
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But then we also had a book
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of primary sources.
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That's right. We had a book of
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primary sources, some
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of which were Middle Eastern
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sources,
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but then mostly European,
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ancient and medieval pieces.
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I guess that was medieval
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European
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primary sources from the medieval
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period.
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But I learned an awful lot,
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and my students did, too.
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And I found it very interesting.
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I don't remember other.
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I think they took English
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every year,
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and the high school
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English was not grammar
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study. It was literature
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and writing.
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I don't remember much about the
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writing.
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I did assign a senior
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research paper, but it had nothing
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to do with literature.
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I don't remember other papers
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that I assigned.
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Thank you.
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So to move on to a different
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topic.
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My next question is
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what sort of training or guidance
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do you remember receiving from the
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administration prior to
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or during your time at Community
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School?
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Was any of this training tailored to
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particular demands of working in a
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school in Iran?
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What about dealing with the
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particular needs of students who
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came from diverse ethnic, religious,
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and national backgrounds?
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I would say none.
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None.
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No kinds of training at
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the School. At least when I was
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there,
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I think it was still assumed that
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basically this is an American school
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and other people have to fit in.
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And they did, except
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for a few.
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We, before we went
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to Iran, we went to an orientation
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at Stony
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Point in New York, which was a
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Presbyterian
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training program,
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but it
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was a general cultural,
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and not specific to Iran.
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We had a few speakers that worked
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in Iran.
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So there was that kind of
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cross-cultural
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preparation before we left the
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States.
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But once in
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Iran, I don't remember
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teacher training
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programs or institutes
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or weeks or days.
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We had faculty meetings I think
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once a week.
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But
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I'm sure today it would be
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different, but that's where it was
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in those days.
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Mr. Beck, if I could follow up on
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something you said a moment ago.
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You mentioned that there were,
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everyone was expected to fit into an
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American style school except
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for a few students who did not fit
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in.
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Can you can you clarify what
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you mean by both the students who
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didn't fit in,
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what was their experience?
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I had mostly in mind academic.
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I remember a few students who were
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not prepared in English
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or in intellect for that
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kind of education.
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So I,
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I remember
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at times,
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well, okay.
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So my main
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thinking had to do with
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academic success there.
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I remember also
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a good friend of mine,
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Ethel Frey,
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had very good rapport with
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many of the Iranian girls,
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and she was aware of some
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of the obvious
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struggles they would have in
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being students in
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an American
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style school where the
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genders were mixed
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and equal
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and Western values prevailed,
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whereas at home other
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values prevailed for the
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Iranian Muslim students.
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That probably was true for the boys
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too, but especially for the girls.
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So sometimes those girls,
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I think, felt
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very conflicted at the school.
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Thank you.
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So for my next question, I'm going
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to move off in a slightly different
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direction.
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I'm wondering during
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your time working at Community
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School, did you live in the school
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compound or outside of it?
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And why did you choose to live where
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you lived?
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Well, we didn't have a lot of
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choices.
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For one thing,
speaker
I would not have wanted to live
speaker
in the school compound.
speaker
Those
speaker
were, where the
speaker
upper level administrators lived,
speaker
and the
speaker
director of the Mission lived,
speaker
Park Johnson.
speaker
Too close to school for my taste.
speaker
We had one choice of living
speaker
in a huge,
speaker
fine
speaker
apartment downtown.
speaker
We could have moved there, and some
speaker
people wanted us to move there, but
speaker
we chose a third floor
speaker
apartment
speaker
just across from the school
speaker
compound.
speaker
And we're very glad that we did.
speaker
It was big enough.
speaker
In fact, bigger than we, bigger
speaker
space to live than we had United
speaker
States.
speaker
It wasn't furnished very much,
speaker
but it was on the third floor.
speaker
And we had a good view
speaker
and we benefited from all
speaker
the dust storms because we
speaker
were up so high and the windows were
speaker
so leaky.
speaker
But we were, I think,
speaker
at a good
speaker
separation from
speaker
the school.
speaker
Now the people below us were
speaker
teachers, but the owner lived in
speaker
the first floor, and he was
speaker
not a teacher and maybe
speaker
not even a Christian.
speaker
There was a
speaker
primary school nearby, so, and
speaker
our neighbors were all Iranians,
speaker
although we didn't get to know them,
speaker
our friends
speaker
or almost all connected
speaker
to the schools, partly because
speaker
of the language
speaker
and association.
speaker
But no, we lived close to the
speaker
school, but not in the school
speaker
compound.
speaker
There was a teacher's residence and
speaker
some of the single teachers lived
speaker
there and Mr. and Mrs. Fennelly
speaker
lived there.
speaker
But as I said, mostly the
speaker
residences were faculty
speaker
or administrators.
speaker
Later on, they built a
speaker
dormitory for
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children of
speaker
mission families who lived away from
speaker
Tehran.
speaker
I think they did.
speaker
I saw it when I returned to Iran
speaker
in 2004.
speaker
From a distance that wasn't there
speaker
when we were there.
speaker
So there may have been
speaker
more facilities for living inside
speaker
the compound as time went on after
speaker
1964.
speaker
I don't know.
speaker
I was surprised when you said that
speaker
that Park Johnson actually lived
speaker
in the school compound.
speaker
Was he was he around all the
speaker
time when you were there, or did he
speaker
have a presence in the school?
speaker
No, he had nothing to do with the
speaker
school.
speaker
He was
speaker
the mission representative for Iran
speaker
and maybe for Afghanistan, too.
speaker
He had lived earlier, I think, in
speaker
Afghanistan or Nepal.
speaker
Afghanistan, I think.
speaker
But he certainly was
speaker
in charge of the Iranian
speaker
Mission and he and Alice lived
speaker
there, but they were
speaker
not connected with the school.
speaker
You haven't been there, have you, to
speaker
the compound?
speaker
I have not. No.
speaker
Okay. There are two big.
speaker
It's a wonderful preserve
speaker
to capture our
speaker
architectural compound, just
speaker
as the church
speaker
downtown, the Protestant church
speaker
downtown is a very
speaker
well-preserved, Qajar-style
speaker
compound with residences,
speaker
school buildings and so on.
speaker
In the case of community school,
speaker
it's the first hospital,
speaker
first Western hospital in
speaker
Tehran, maybe in the whole country.
speaker
So it was a strange place
speaker
to have school.
speaker
You're aware of that, I guess,
speaker
aren't you?
speaker
Yeah, I had I had heard that.
speaker
Yeah. So it's an old hospital that
speaker
was adjusted to school, so
speaker
we had ramps
speaker
and some tiny
speaker
rooms, although the facility
speaker
was okay, so I didn't complain
speaker
about it at all. Anyway,
speaker
what was I talking about?
speaker
The layout of the compound.
speaker
Park Johnson.
speaker
Yes.
speaker
The compound had, as I
speaker
recall, two
speaker
or three large
speaker
brick and stucco
speaker
residences, I
speaker
suppose originally for the doctors,
speaker
I guess.
speaker
And that's where the principal and
speaker
the assistant principals families
speaker
lived and Park Johnson.
speaker
And so there must have been three
speaker
big residences served
speaker
usually by servants,
speaker
and a swimming pool, which was
speaker
not kept up, and a
speaker
"Teacherage".
speaker
So it was a building
speaker
with many
speaker
apartments for single teachers,
speaker
although Fennellys lived there as a
speaker
couple close to the school.
speaker
And then there were some low-lying
speaker
brick and stucco buildings for some
speaker
of the Iranian
speaker
families who were
speaker
long term servants on
speaker
the compound.
speaker
And there were some
speaker
some kind of building that was a
speaker
student activity
speaker
room. It was really miserable,
speaker
but that's where they had dances or
speaker
parties.
speaker
And I think that didn't last long
speaker
after we left.
speaker
But basically, it was an old
speaker
hospital.
speaker
So to go back to something that
speaker
you mentioned earlier about
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socializing with other teachers at
speaker
the school, I'm wondering, I know in
speaker
the 1970s there was quite a large
speaker
community of American ex-pats in
speaker
Tehran.
speaker
I'm wondering if at the time you
speaker
were there, there was also an
speaker
American community that was
speaker
independent of the school and
speaker
and how if in any way you were
speaker
connected to that community?
speaker
Yes, there was a very large
speaker
Army community.
speaker
And we called them
speaker
because the Americans were arming
speaker
the Shah.
speaker
And there were all kinds of
speaker
technical and military
speaker
families there, and they had their
speaker
own school.
speaker
And sometimes we got students
speaker
from that school, parents who
speaker
wanted them to be in a more
speaker
international setting
speaker
or Persian setting, than in
speaker
the American school.
speaker
We played the American school in
speaker
soccer and I don't know what else.
speaker
We had very little
speaker
to do with that school,
speaker
but we sort of looked down at that
speaker
school because they were just
speaker
Americans in
speaker
their own American community and so
speaker
on. It was unfortunate that
speaker
we had that attitude, but that's
speaker
the way we looked at and we felt
speaker
that we were international
speaker
and intercultural and
speaker
Iranian and
speaker
they were not.
speaker
But I have no, I never set foot
speaker
in that school.
speaker
We took advantage of some
speaker
of the American presence.
speaker
They had a beautiful theater
speaker
up in north Tehran.
speaker
Eventually, at their information
speaker
center, we would go to plays
speaker
they had. There was an American
speaker
amateur theater group, which I
speaker
performed in a couple of times.
speaker
They gave their place down in the
speaker
middle of Tehran and before
speaker
that information center was built.
speaker
There were a couple of restaurants
speaker
maintained for the American
speaker
community that we went to.
speaker
There was even a kind
speaker
of commissary downtown
speaker
that Americans
speaker
could use.
speaker
Maybe only Americans, I'm not sure.
speaker
But, and
speaker
we went to the American Club a
speaker
couple of times with some friends,
speaker
but we did not seek out
speaker
those relationships.
speaker
And I actually
speaker
knew very little about the American
speaker
presence. Sometimes we met people
speaker
from
speaker
the oil industry
speaker
because partly because many of us
speaker
sent their children to community
speaker
school, too.
speaker
So
speaker
but I think I met more Persian
speaker
parents than I did American
speaker
parents.
speaker
Yeah.
speaker
That's that's a good and and I think
speaker
that community only increased after
speaker
1964
speaker
of course precipitating
speaker
some of the revolution.
speaker
And go ahead.
speaker
No you can go ahead.
speaker
Well, my awareness, of course, of
speaker
Iran and Iranian,
speaker
what was going on in Iran was shaped
speaker
by Kayhan newspaper,
speaker
the English language newspaper.
speaker
So that was
speaker
I think it wasn't owned by the
speaker
government as it is now,
speaker
but it sort of gave had to give
speaker
the g?vernment side of things.
speaker
So we knew
speaker
very little about the troubles
speaker
that were brewing,
speaker
although we had students whose
speaker
parents were involved.
speaker
I remember one student
speaker
whose uncle was in jail for being
speaker
a threat to the government,
speaker
but his father was high up in the
speaker
government, in the
speaker
Shah's government.
speaker
So all
speaker
of that, all those
speaker
tensions were not very
speaker
clear to us.
speaker
Until one day
speaker
there was this
speaker
uprising.
speaker
And that was the time when Khomeini
speaker
fled Iran for France
speaker
and there were tanks in the street
speaker
for three days.
speaker
The school was shut down, the
speaker
government gained control.
speaker
So I think I only understood
speaker
what was going on. Then I
speaker
read about it,
speaker
but that's a long story.
speaker
I'm saying is that
speaker
we were sort of isolated
speaker
from the American community and
speaker
certainly from everyday
speaker
discussions about
speaker
Islamic Iran.
speaker
But on the other hand, we were
speaker
working in an international
speaker
community.
speaker
Faculty members came from different
speaker
parts of the world and and
speaker
from different segments of Iran,
speaker
Armenian, Assyrian, Islamic.
speaker
In Iran
speaker
and faculty members from
speaker
around the world.
speaker
So it was really great.
speaker
Thank you.
speaker
So a few moments ago, you mentioned
speaker
becoming friendly with some of the
speaker
Persian families in your school.
speaker
I'm wondering what sort of
speaker
interactions you had with
speaker
the families of those in your
speaker
other students if you became
speaker
friendly with the families were you
speaker
ever invited to visit their homes?
speaker
And if so, you could tell me about
speaker
those experiences?
speaker
I think it was mostly when the
speaker
families came to school for
speaker
parent meetings.
speaker
We were invited to.
speaker
one family
speaker
home. This was a Christian home.
speaker
The talk is is
speaker
one night for supper with some other
speaker
faculty. We were invited to
speaker
faculty members' homes on various
speaker
occasions.
speaker
I think I was I can say that was
speaker
limited sometimes,
speaker
but we had an Armenian
speaker
vice principal, Miss Sahakian who
speaker
took us to a Persian nightclub,
speaker
which was very interesting.
speaker
So I went to a lot of those
speaker
social events.
speaker
We had faculty social events, which
speaker
were very interesting
speaker
and pleasurable.
speaker
But no, I don't think the
speaker
relationships were intimate at all
speaker
basically. But we did meet
speaker
them.
speaker
Sometimes they would come after the
speaker
students or being
speaker
behind, and sometimes
speaker
we received gifts from students who
speaker
weren't doing so well.
speaker
Earlier in the conversation, you
speaker
mentioned
speaker
that the demographics of the student
speaker
body was about a third American,
speaker
a third Iraqi, and
speaker
a third international students, a
speaker
mix of international students.
speaker
Can you tell me any more about the
speaker
demographics of the student body,
speaker
how all those particular groups
speaker
ended up at the school or or
speaker
what other nationalities were
speaker
represented?
speaker
Okay. I remember a
speaker
student from Sweden.
speaker
I remember a student from
speaker
Jordan.
speaker
I remember wonderful
speaker
students from Japan.
speaker
A student from Canada.
speaker
Pakistan.
speaker
I'm not sure I can
speaker
bring to mind
speaker
students of other nationalities.
speaker
But anyway, that's a pretty good
speaker
range.
speaker
We had a student, I had a student
speaker
who was, I meann a lot
speaker
of students who were have
speaker
had mixed parentage.
speaker
So one boy was
speaker
Greek, but his
speaker
mother was
speaker
Iranian, I think.
speaker
And that was true of other
speaker
other kids who were
speaker
of dual nationalities or
speaker
dual cultures.
speaker
And coming to an English school was
speaker
maybe not a compromise, but one
speaker
solution
speaker
for them.
speaker
Do you have records, enrollment
speaker
records from the school?
speaker
So I have
speaker
some, but they're not complete.
speaker
I have
speaker
enrollment records from almost every
speaker
year in the 1940s
speaker
and the early fifties.
speaker
And then in the 1960s,
speaker
I have a few yearbooks
speaker
that that list the nationalities.
speaker
But but unfortunately I don't have a
speaker
complete.
speaker
I have a year, I have a yearbook
speaker
here.
speaker
I can look at it.Actually,
speaker
I have three yearbooks.
speaker
I think Mrs. Bethune was
speaker
the yearbook sponsor.
speaker
If I look at the
speaker
'64 graduating
speaker
class, for instance.
speaker
But ladies, here I am looking
speaker
very young.
speaker
Okay.
speaker
It was hard to tell
speaker
who the Jewish students were from
speaker
Iraq and who the Iranians
speaker
were. That was one of the puzzles.
speaker
I think, partly because sometimes
speaker
the Jewish
speaker
people from Iraq took on Persian
speaker
names.
speaker
Okay. Chris Bauer was a German.
speaker
Doug Bird was American.
speaker
Here we have Bostani.
speaker
He must be Iranian.
speaker
Bulbulian was Armenian.
speaker
Cavness was American.
speaker
Wonderful student.
speaker
Chartrand was American.
speaker
Chitayat was
speaker
Iraqi Jew.
speaker
Sabah Dabby was Iraqi Jew.
speaker
Gloria Dallal.
speaker
Is that a Persian name?
speaker
I think that's a Jewish name.
speaker
Bennet Davidian:
speaker
Armenian.
speaker
Igor Effimoff: Russian, white
speaker
Russian. His ancestors
speaker
fled Russia after
speaker
the revolution.
speaker
Soraya Eqbal, that would be
speaker
Persian.
speaker
Ferry Ghadar. I think
speaker
he was a Persian.
speaker
Gilanshah: Persian.
speaker
Haroun was Jewish.
speaker
Menashi.
speaker
I don't know.
speaker
Wingolf Muller was German.
speaker
Mina Motammed.
speaker
She was mixed, Persian
speaker
and English, I think.
speaker
Jean Muller: American.
speaker
Bassim Nathan:
speaker
Jewish.
speaker
Samandari: Persian.
speaker
Shamoon: Jewish.
speaker
Terpanjian:
speaker
Armenian.
speaker
Carola von Haussen:
speaker
Swedish and American.
speaker
Wellman: American.
speaker
Samir Sofer: Jewish,
speaker
for instance.
speaker
That's the senior graduating class
speaker
that year.
speaker
Thank you.
speaker
They came and went.
speaker
Of course, we had a very
speaker
unstable
speaker
enrollment because
speaker
of the international community
speaker
anyway.
speaker
Even the American community, people
speaker
would be there for
speaker
two years, three years, or
speaker
one year.
speaker
Thank you. So, Mr. Beck, I just have
speaker
one last question on my list.
speaker
I'm wondering if you could do your
speaker
best to
speaker
articulate for me
speaker
the mission of the school at the
speaker
time you were there, if you're able
speaker
to, to recall
speaker
what a mission statement would have
speaker
been if if there was one.
speaker
There may have been, a
speaker
firm principal,
speaker
Richard Irvine, who really
speaker
is the person who defined the
speaker
school.
speaker
He had a board that he really,
speaker
where he was responsible to others,
speaker
but he really did
speaker
what he thought
speaker
best and, he was very
speaker
international minded.
speaker
So a very idealistic
speaker
man.
speaker
I don't know, is he still alive?
speaker
The last I had heard is that he is
speaker
still alive living in Arizona.
speaker
Yes. And I know his wife says I
speaker
haven't seen any photos of him
speaker
on Facebook. Have you talked to him?
speaker
I haven't. I reached out to
speaker
him through email and
speaker
sent a letter, but I have not heard
speaker
back from from him yet.
speaker
He may not be capable.
speaker
I don't know.
speaker
I haven't heard anyway.
speaker
He was extremely idealistic
speaker
man, and
speaker
Christian yes, but that wasn't
speaker
his
speaker
overt motivation or the way
speaker
he talked.
speaker
He did not
speaker
publicly or
speaker
even with the faculty,
speaker
emphasize the Christian mission of
speaker
the school.
speaker
Yes, he was a
speaker
devout Presbyterian,
speaker
but I wouldn't say that he saw it as
speaker
a Christian mission,
speaker
except in terms
speaker
of Christian
speaker
service, and promoting
speaker
human welfare throughout the world
speaker
and was very internationally minded.
speaker
So that was his mission,to
speaker
serve and create an international
speaker
community in an
speaker
English speaking school with an
speaker
American, pretty American
speaker
curriculum. There were no I think
speaker
there were no controls over the
speaker
school by the government
speaker
because it was regarded as a
speaker
foreign
speaker
enterprise.
speaker
And of course, things were quite
speaker
tolerant under the Shah.
speaker
But the mission itself would have
speaker
expected the
speaker
the school to be
speaker
a part of its
speaker
program.
speaker
But even at that point,
speaker
the Presbyterian
speaker
mission had almost given up.
speaker
The hospitals, there were still
speaker
practicing doctors and maybe a
speaker
hospital here or there.
speaker
But pretty much the mission
speaker
was seen as a service
speaker
to a
speaker
community in Iran.
speaker
Some of the employees
speaker
were a little more vigorous than
speaker
others in terms of,
speaker
I don't like to use the word
speaker
proselytizing, in
speaker
terms of being traditional
speaker
missionaries, but
speaker
they were not
speaker
in Tehran.
speaker
They were, from what I recall, they
speaker
were in the province.
speaker
So there may have been a little
speaker
conflict between what the mission
speaker
expected.
speaker
In fact, there was conflict between
speaker
the mission and the school, and
speaker
what was actually the case
speaker
at the school under Mr. Irvine.
speaker
So his philosophy
speaker
guided the school.
speaker
And I don't know, it's not a
speaker
concise way of
speaker
saying things, but
speaker
does that make sense?
speaker
That does make sense.
speaker
Thank you.
speaker
I just wanted-.
speaker
Eventually, of course.
speaker
Richard Irvine created his own
speaker
school.
speaker
Iran's, I mean, which I think
speaker
had no Christian pretensions
speaker
at all.
speaker
Community school remained under
speaker
the Mission, under other
speaker
administrators, but Dick Irvine
speaker
created a new school
speaker
so that he could pursue his own
speaker
educational philosophy.
speaker
So I suppose
speaker
there was somewhat
speaker
of a conflict
speaker
at the time when we were there, but
speaker
it was, I would say, beyond
speaker
the school. It was not present in
speaker
the school.
speaker
Can you give me an example of of
speaker
of what such a conflict would be?
speaker
Of what?
speaker
You said that that at times, even if
speaker
it was in the background, there was
speaker
there was occasionally conflict
speaker
between the mission and the school.
speaker
Can you give me an example of?
speaker
That was observed by
speaker
us in what we called "Station
speaker
Meetings"
speaker
so that sometimes
speaker
things were said about the school
speaker
by other employees
speaker
of the mission that
speaker
illustrated some kind
speaker
of conflict there.
speaker
And I don't know if that was
speaker
probably mostly personal
speaker
conflict.
speaker
The people in the mission thought
speaker
that Dick Irvine was a little
speaker
too independent of the mission,
speaker
for instance, and
speaker
which is what I was just telling
speaker
you, that he had a international,
speaker
cross-cultural, service
speaker
motivation, whereas the mission had
speaker
more of a
speaker
proclamation mission.
speaker
But I was not,
speaker
we were never
speaker
much integrated
speaker
into the mission itself,
speaker
even though we were technically very
speaker
under the mission.
speaker
I don't know if it was possible to
speaker
be an expatriate,
speaker
teaching at that school
speaker
outside of mission
speaker
employment or not.
speaker
I think it might have been, people
speaker
might have applied directly to the
speaker
school.
speaker
Certainly, if they were already
speaker
living in the,
speaker
in Tehran,
speaker
they might have got jobs teaching at
speaker
the school, independent of the
speaker
mission, I don't know what was
speaker
required there.
speaker
All I know is that we and
speaker
other people who signed up for three
speaker
year terms, or
speaker
went through the
speaker
Presbyterian mission.
speaker
Thank you. So so that's the
speaker
last question that I have
speaker
before we wrap up.
speaker
I'm I'm wondering if there's
speaker
anything that we haven't
speaker
talked about that you'd like to tell
speaker
me, either an aspect of the school
speaker
that's important that we haven't
speaker
touched on or a memory
speaker
that you have that's particularly
speaker
vivid.
speaker
Now would be a good time to share
speaker
something like that.
speaker
It's just too bad that once we
speaker
returned to the States, we were
speaker
quite cut off from
speaker
the lives of our students there.
speaker
We kept in touch with a few,
speaker
but we really loved those
speaker
kids and
speaker
were involved in their lives and
speaker
it's too bad that we have lost
speaker
track of them.
speaker
We went to one reunion, which
speaker
was in
speaker
Toronto and there's a community
speaker
school reunion coming up somewhere,
speaker
I think.
speaker
Which maybe you could attend.
speaker
Some of what we know about
speaker
some of our students is very
speaker
interesting.
speaker
One of the Jewish students, alot
speaker
of the Jewish students went to
speaker
Israel.
speaker
And one of my favorite students
speaker
was killed in I think the
speaker
1967 war opinions
speaker
are, wonderful kid.
speaker
And another one became
speaker
the owner of the Toyota
speaker
franchise in all of Israel.
speaker
Other students went to graduate
speaker
school in the United States,
speaker
became doctors,
speaker
and professors and so on.
speaker
Igor Effimoff, mentioned
speaker
being of Russian background,
speaker
became a big executive
speaker
in international oil,
speaker
gas.
speaker
So it's it's just hard
speaker
to know what effect
speaker
we had on these students.
speaker
I think
speaker
the motivation for the students
speaker
was to get an English education
speaker
and move on and move out.
speaker
That was certainly true for the
speaker
Iraqi Jews and I'm sure for many
speaker
of the Islamic students.
speaker
So that we were, we were their
speaker
vehicle or venue for
speaker
moving on, or advancement
speaker
and making their way in the world.
speaker
And that's okay with me.
speaker
So that if the school
speaker
had lofty ideals,
speaker
I'm sure the intercultural ideals
speaker
were pretty well served.
speaker
I don't know about the Christian
speaker
ideals.
speaker
I mean, surely
speaker
we were good people.
speaker
I think we were good role models for
speaker
the students, whether
speaker
they accepted
speaker
what we represented.
speaker
I don't know.
speaker
I was sort of ticked off when
speaker
I went to the
speaker
community school reunion in Toronto.
speaker
Some former student
speaker
wrote an essay somewhere
speaker
exposing the
speaker
presumed colonizing
speaker
effect of the school.
speaker
Well, I
speaker
have written about
speaker
postcolonial literary criticism,
speaker
so I know what he means,
speaker
but I think
speaker
that's unfair.
speaker
We didn't go there to colonize
speaker
anybody, and
speaker
nobody was forced to
speaker
go there. It wasn't a government
speaker
decree. It was entirely
speaker
of
speaker
free will of the students and their
speaker
parents.
speaker
I think it was a benevolent
speaker
school and the people who taught
speaker
there did at some
speaker
considerable sacrifice and with
speaker
positive motivation.
speaker
So of course, I can see
speaker
how there was cultural transfer.
speaker
But in terms of hegemony or
speaker
dominance or colonizing,
speaker
I think that's grossly unfair.
speaker
So I hope you aren't going to take
speaker
that angle. But if you do, okay,
speaker
go ahead.
speaker
But that's my position on
speaker
that kind of question.
speaker
Well, Beck, go ahead.
speaker
Has that come up?
speaker
Has that come up in your
speaker
consideration of the school?
speaker
So
speaker
I have not speculated
speaker
that the school had a
speaker
colonizing function.
speaker
I am, one of the things I
speaker
have wondered is whether
speaker
the the the ideals
speaker
of international cooperation
speaker
were maybe informed by the Cold
speaker
War and by
speaker
sort of U.S. international interest
speaker
during the Cold War.
speaker
But but but hegemony and
speaker
colonization haven't really come up
speaker
as themes in what I've seen.
speaker
Well, we were in the middle of the
speaker
Cold War.
speaker
And Vietnam was one manifestation
speaker
of the Cold War turning
speaker
hot.
speaker
Overtly.
speaker
No, we never talked about
speaker
Russia as far as I know.
speaker
We didn't have any Russian students.
speaker
But of course, Iran was not friendly
speaker
with Russia at that point either.
speaker
The Russian community in
speaker
Tehran was orthodox and
speaker
white, Russian really refugees
speaker
from Russia.
speaker
So that the attitude toward Russia
speaker
in those days was very negative.
speaker
I guess that element in
speaker
the Cold War.
speaker
But I don't,
speaker
I suppose the
speaker
score in some indirect way
speaker
for some students reinforced
speaker
American values rather than Russian.
speaker
But I don't think that people wanted
speaker
Russian values.
speaker
So I'm sure it was part
speaker
of the Cold War scene,
speaker
but I don't know how that would have
speaker
been.
speaker
I'm probably blind because I was
speaker
there involved in
speaker
it and
speaker
I don't know,
speaker
maybe you can make something of
speaker
that. But
speaker
all I can say is it
speaker
was part of that milieu
speaker
and part of the politics,
speaker
obviously, because as soon as the
speaker
revolution happened, as
speaker
Christians had to go. So
speaker
whether, but the revolution.
speaker
I guess the revolution can be tied
speaker
into the Cold War because the United
speaker
States was supporting
speaker
the Shah and the Shah was
speaker
suppressing the
speaker
clergy.
speaker
So good luck as you pursue
speaker
that. Yeah.
speaker
What's your, what's the attitude of
speaker
your professors toward the school?
speaker
Let me think.
speaker
I mean the overall
speaker
the attitude of my professors, as
speaker
well as the attitude of
speaker
the other students that I've spoken
speaker
to, is
speaker
in some ways extremely positive.
speaker
They they all have said that they
speaker
felt like they got a really strong
speaker
education academically
speaker
and that the values
speaker
they learned of intercultural
speaker
cooperation
speaker
have continued to be extremely
speaker
valuable for
speaker
them. One
speaker
of one of my professors
speaker
has said that she thought that
speaker
in some ways the school was, was,
speaker
was too American or there
speaker
were, there was a focus on
speaker
aspects of American culture that she
speaker
thought was sort of a waste of time.
speaker
Maybe, you know, in the seventies
speaker
they started a football team, for
speaker
example.
speaker
But but other students-.
speaker
I didn't know that.
speaker
But but an American football team.
speaker
But but other students really liked
speaker
that and thought that was really fun
speaker
so.
speaker
Did they graduate from the community
speaker
school or from the Iranzamin?
speaker
From the community school.
speaker
Okay. I don't see how they could
speaker
play football in the compound.
speaker
They must play football somewhere
speaker
else.
speaker
Well, by way, go ahead.
speaker
The story that I heard was that
speaker
the Tehran American School or
speaker
the embassy school that you talked
speaker
about wanted to have another
speaker
team to play against.
speaker
They were sick of playing each other
speaker
all the time.
speaker
So they got the community school to
speaker
establish a football team so they
speaker
would have some competition.
speaker
But anyway, that's neither neither
speaker
here nor there.
speaker
I think we played soccer when I was
speaker
there. We played
speaker
outdoor basketball and I
speaker
was there.
speaker
Yes, we had a big outdoor
speaker
basketball rink, a basketball
speaker
court.
speaker
I forget what I was going to end.
speaker
Well, I'm glad to hear that
speaker
they had a good experience there.
speaker
I don't see how they
speaker
could help, but unless they
speaker
had
speaker
to control the situation that
speaker
they really didn't want to be there.
speaker
But then why would they be there?
speaker
It was very expensive for
speaker
Persians, I know that.
speaker
So we had pretty much an elite
speaker
student body.
speaker
Considering everything, I don't
speaker
think. We gave some scholarships,
speaker
but were didn't go out of our way to
speaker
recruit
speaker
people.
speaker
Well, Mr. Beck, thank you so much
speaker
for taking the time to talk to me
speaker
about this. This has just been so
speaker
fascinating for me, and I really
speaker
appreciate it.
speaker
I hope I gave you
speaker
information that you wanted
speaker
and that will be useful to you.
speaker
Absolutely.
speaker
And like I said, the first thing
speaker
that you should expect from me is
speaker
a transcript of
speaker
this conversation for you to to
speaker
look over and make any changes
speaker
that you need to.
speaker
And then, of course, when I'm
speaker
finished with the thesis this
speaker
spring, I'll be sure to send you
speaker
send you that as well.
speaker
I pity anybody who has to transcribe
speaker
any interview, including
speaker
mine. I've done plenty of that
speaker
and that's not easy to do.
speaker
I was going to add that,
speaker
of course, I'm
speaker
teaching and working in Iran
speaker
at a young age.
speaker
We were maybe 22
speaker
to 24, had
speaker
a big influence
speaker
on our outlook
speaker
on the world and life
speaker
and religion, politics,
speaker
history.
speaker
We're, of course, very concerned
speaker
about Iran, very happy
speaker
about the nuclear
speaker
deal. And Iran is
speaker
now in
speaker
talks with the United States and
speaker
other countries. So it's really
speaker
encouraging.
speaker
We have, I went to
speaker
Iran again in 2004
speaker
on a study tour sponsored
speaker
by the Mennonite Church, and the
speaker
Mennonite church has had
speaker
programs there.
speaker
Some of the actually
speaker
the first American exchange
speaker
program at Qom,
speaker
at the seminary, in Qom.
speaker
People
speaker
from the seminary studied in
speaker
Toronto, Canada.
speaker
And there were an American
speaker
couple at Qom.
speaker
And that relationship
speaker
maintained for a long time.
speaker
And as a result, I
speaker
went, well, I was on that
speaker
study visit in 2004,
speaker
which was really wonderful.
speaker
And since then we've become
speaker
good friends of an Iranian
speaker
couple.
speaker
She has been at the University of
speaker
Notre Dame and
speaker
their son graduated from Goshen
speaker
College, actually, and
speaker
their daughter is at Mennonite
speaker
School right now and they're
speaker
Muslims.
speaker
So a lot of things
speaker
keep on happening that are
speaker
important to us in our
speaker
lives.
speaker
We got a big Persian rug in the
speaker
living room and so on.
speaker
So
speaker
that's the other aspect.
speaker
It's an exchange, isn't it?
speaker
Cultural exchange.
speaker
We gave a lot to the school, all
speaker
those people and those people
speaker
gave a lot to us and
speaker
we're everlastingly grateful.
speaker
And it's too bad.
speaker
To go to Iran and see that compound
speaker
all locked up and
speaker
the buildings, I suppose, decaying,
speaker
the trees growing
speaker
up all over.
speaker
And apparently it's still regarded
speaker
as owned by Americans.
speaker
And so the government hasn't quite
speaker
taken that over.
speaker
It's shown as apart
speaker
on the map, but
speaker
the church is still a lively
speaker
Protestant church.
speaker
Believe it or not,
speaker
something Sunday
speaker
and the Koreans
speaker
have revived it.
speaker
The Korean Presbyterians,
speaker
a lot of them have come to Iran
speaker
with the Kia Motor Company.
speaker
And so they are keeping
speaker
that school, that
speaker
church compound and the school
speaker
are going.
speaker
So it's not all over
speaker
yet.
speaker
Anyway, I could go on and on, butu
speaker
se what you like.
speaker
Well, thank you again, Mr. Beck,
speaker
again for this conversation.
speaker
And I'll be in touch soon.
speaker
Okay?
speaker
All right.
speaker
Thank you again.
speaker
Bye bye.
speaker
Do you want my address or
speaker
just the email?
speaker
So would you prefer me to to mail
speaker
you the transcript by mail or to
speaker
email it? I can do either.
speaker
Email. Email is fine.
speaker
Okay. Certainly.
speaker
Okay. I enjoyed the conversation
speaker
and always glad to talk about.
speaker
Iran.
speaker
Great. Well, thank you again.
speaker
Enjoy your weekend.
speaker
All right. Thank you. Goodbye.
speaker
Bye.

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Title: Ervin Beck oral history, 2015.
Description: Oral history interview with Ervin Beck, a former teacher of the Community School in Tehran, Iran. Conducted as part of a series of interviews by Julian Cole Phillips during research for his M.A. thesis, "Missionary Education in the American Century: The Changing Mission of the Tehran Community School, 1932-1980.”
Creator: Phillips, Julian Cole. (interviewer)
Beck, Ervin. (interviewee)
Date: 2015
October 30, 2015
Type of resource: sound recording
Genre: oral histories
interviews
Form: born digital
Extent: 652 MB (1 WAV file)
Language: English
Subject names: Community School (Tehran, Iran)
Beck, Ervin.
Topics: Missions--Educational work--Iran--Tehran.
Community schools--Iran--Tehran.
Mennonites.
Geographic subjects: Iran
Tehran.
Tehran (Iran)
Asia--Iran--Tehrān--Tehran
Rights status: IN COPYRIGHT; http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/
Physical location: ARCHIVES 17-1222; Presbyterian Historical Society, Philadelphia, PA
Related item: Julian Cole Phillips Tehran Community School oral histories, 2015-2016.--https://catalog.history.pcusa.org/cgi-bin/koha/opac-detail.pl?biblionumb...
Identifier (local): Interview_Ervin_Beck
PID (Persistent Identifier): islandora:285933

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