I

things

leading up to my conversion. Actually, while I'm talking about that, my association with

those young

people runs very, very

satisfactory and enjoyable to me.

a common group of young people that I was interesting. Of course,

my girlfriend was in that church. And, I was I was living

my first month out what's I grew up in my senior

year. And, the interesting thing is that her name was

Joan Fields. And I married Jane Woods.

[Laughter] Anyhow,

But back to the to

McDonald and his messages. He did not have one conversion

in that entire week.

And, here on the last night of that campaign,

he gave an invitation that I waited for five

verses of "Just as I Am," before I raised my hand, and I

accepted Christ as my Savior, as a result of that. Because I knew that there was a

possibility

that this whole world of entertainment was not going to be satisfactory. So you?

At the same time now, at the same time. i had other interests

Other than performing and in the middle. And that was because of my literary

work.

I had written an article for the school paper, concerning the Haddington mystery

urging every hatter who worked for the hatter

be sure you wear a hat. And that was an article.

One of the executives of the Frank H. Hat Company

read that article. Heard about that article.

Commended me in that. and offered me and made possible for me to have

a partial scholarship to Yale

journalism school. As far as a possible.

Possibility for me. Upon graduation I could consider going to Yale

journalism school as one of my options. But then I got converted in the meantime, see?

So that

my interest in that particular field left me. I

was picking blueberries with my brother in the summer of that

year after my conversion. Now my elder brother. What year

was your conversion? Thirty-nine.. Do you know what time of year was it?

February. were that we

First week of February. Yeah, the first weekend of February. Five or

six is what. When I had my observation and my conversion. The weekend of February

fifth and sixth.

But after my conversion, there must have been some obvious

changes in

me. One thing was. I was not a really cursing kind

of person. Moving but I never really used profanity at

all after my conversion. It was remarkable. And my brother

noticed that. My younger brother was back

from college. He graduated in thirty-nine from college.

And, we were picking blueberries.

And he noticed a change in me. He

said, you're so interested in religion now, he said, Why don't you become a

minister? and I said, No, I'd never consider that, because.

Because the only ministers I ever knew were the Episcopal

minister who came maybe once a

year to visit my parents in our house and he had his collar on backwards.

And he drank with

his tea with a pinky finger sticking out, you know. My impression of ministers

was not good. And I had them or because they were kind

of compassion our distance and then we went bad.

Perhaps a little bit louder than not

Skilling and up for me more in the realm has

it that all of that you know. To doing this act then.

Now we ask you to that.

But instead of that does not her man. Like the business.

That visit with them. And that's really the only cause I never knew any other minister.

The A push couple service was so

talk to

me in comparing that to rather I

saw in the year a lot of

have in the Methodist Church. When I went to acquire Urso. At the

Methodist Church. It was burning day. And when I got there early. I would sit

and listen to the

programming and it was totally within the totally strange slogan

We had people talking to God is the biggest part of the

family dinner happen they bother. I never had any any

personal background would were not know anything about that as

a personal relation. Right to voice cliche their personal relationship with

God writer her luggage was the party the others a Methodist church

exact community that religion are welcome You sound like a high meaning and somewhat awkward.

Now I

have somebody associated myself with no be able to group.

At the Methodist Church. After Michael Very here we did a lot of things together. We make

this is two different conferences. All in the six month

period prior to my going to the little

theater I went to a couple of

conferences amount burning up with the own people it was a real great

great only experience for me. And there was one man. In that Methodist Church.

In the name of jihad Rush really took up the

Cybermen and he took Make it was. And his mother

was bright and. She would be able to move.

Just as if she was a sighted person rather than memorized. She was an inspiration.

As well it's

been.

So let me follow through. So let that question that

my brother as many.

After I got the ball now. I thought to myself. Maybe he was running.

You know enough months between our.

The next big incident was when that one people's group rather than

five years to go to a conference in

Barrington that war college in problems rather than. I'm the Labor Day weekend.

Listen the Labor Day weekend nineteen thirty. And that's when World

War two here. Started. Yep.

And at that conference was an upstanding

tenor a little coward from Blue.

And he had a motoring grub cap and we were by

the in there on the morning broadcast. And when we went to

that broadcast we were just about to grow on me when we were preempted

by the announcement

that the Germans had attacked to

the track caused by Robert Eckels the bucket with the latter but some have

been bats when Pope maybe was following the September night whatever it was it

was that well. That would have been so good I may be going on more work to.

Yep Yep I think you're right my way. After

K. have to have a trip to the number nine hundred thirty nine. And then France in.

Bravery declare war on terror. Right and that right was always had a hand. That was a

weekend.

I've started alone will say what I don't remember much what I but I do remember

how impressed I was with them. Marvelous boys some current

rules can

you share that how to lose and have called

a program called on the mountaintop. Hour. And that's what we were magnet goes

in and the theme song of that nigger learned by heart I know

that in some numb. Part of the

little rubber room. That was the things a lot of progress. But the guy had such a

glorious time in a voice that I was a he was a

lynch Parisian. I later met them. Knew him personally enjoyed

it and he later became the president of were the

treasurer of rural Vision International that was started by probably the

purest you remember the visions are still operative. Were of Asian. There

were only in were in Haiti and so what the current mood for many years. Was

a treasure. In the road. That

leaders humans drive the Real World Vision.

Bob Peters was

there but whether or

no so you. How did you end up from

the moon there if you know when your brother OK All right my

girlfriend. Jordan fields. Had a and girlfriend.

By the name of Ellen Stacy and Ellen Stacy's father

was pastor of the Baptist church in Denver. And I

never went to the Baptist

church. But balance. General were very close aloes

said Joe

when there was a program unsettled out the other crowd and young people stretch

of the air and I heard it last week. And they are asking

for ten or perhaps our would be interested in applying for

that which is exactly one of the. I wrote to Dr Percy

Cropper a post office box to con the now and said I would like to try to

help record that they were going to get me a little bit of the is true that I was a

son was a loser. I would like to try out for that quarter. He got me

back and the lease and I have the letters.

You said we are having a banquet. In New York City.

At the Rogers hotel. And if you could come down for

that we'll give you around decision. At that time. So that's what

I

did was the bike was on a Saturday night.

And I went down the train and went to

the writers hotel. And the really

copper person croppers was the news ition or the people's Turkey where.

And she had me saying. She learned what songs do you know I didn't know

any of the worst of all. All right who is one a brand we haven't Jesus.

So I sound rather. We haven't Jesus and she was impressed.

And she said maybe and person Crawford was an interesting man.

The fact that I

was the a boy from Denver you can

either get not much of a background or appeal to him. He he was

a. He was a man who always appreciated people like

racial Alger dollar each you know he cannot get money as

a by was not the

interesting because not because he came from a hard scrabble upper. But because he would not

permit religious background. I think that's it.

I mean one thousand little bit about Percy

Crocker. Her luck. There is a cropper it was a

man who were who was a great combination

a looter sing harmonization I'm sure.

It was business principles.

Probably promised then that all of those of captors. But he was a

very quick.

Not quick tempered but he was the Victoria. OK.

And he was quick to fire people.

If they crossed him at all or didn't do on it

because the rules. It's amazing that I record tense.

Them with them for six years and none of us ever got fired.

We're going to talk about them.

And I think person Congress through on the city

has developed a great understanding with the West

to miss back to our lot. But I feed an hour in self.

Model harder weeks. PRESS.

Ralph loser to his family. Of

brotherly children or love you love them and probably

for the money was related to it then the fact. Move. Really knew how

to express not. So he was what fifteen twenty years older than him then

was born. Yes twenty years

older and luckily black and brown where he ended up and where

he kind of our lives and came really among a group or planet. In

the police who went through was so nervous.

Where he studied a new look by babble is to have the rotten.

When went to quit in college and graduate from college. Had news

a clue the actual number the excellent every move in the US

where

I think he was number two on the weekend.

But still felt was not musical. But it is what it

was rooms.

So he got in with. What was his business how did he end up and

tell evangelist. From even Avengers you have a public speaker.

Oh yes. From from Alice Through his rags after

risk aversion. He

was converted by an Irish evangelism. And none of us

and from the time with humans in biology. He had teams

of young people who write with to evangelise it means those who

had evangelists a million dollars really is adult life.

And then eventually came to know whether and when the organization he had

placed that you call the young people's George was near and give a church there he was a radio.

Regulars in their regular broadcast intervention really how many are seven hundred.

Nationwide radio

stations of the broadcast. So I live in the lane of the Charles whether it

was last or buy a home of the same

caliber or LORAN think more people who knew of the or bashing

them our the new person carbon. Versa grabber dominated is the film about

the New Jersey. As of a New York area. We haven't mingle.

But beyond

that you would probably not the most well known in the Midwest on the West.

Even though we talk Crips and the libertarian. Because of our radio

station. So if our ending point for this session. Is when you met.

Jane was. We today. Would you

then you know. He hire you. And he moved to Philadelphia. Less.

And you're right Tyner your primary. I

have my my location budget grabber or the

bookstore at just well and eighty seven in

just seven thirty just last week was the I broke I have read. It is

OK Cuomo. But still which punk rock was the name of

the summer camp. That person cropper. The

man only knew casually. He actual or LEO's in the broken about in

the

Pennsylvania right to be strong to murder.

OK. I don't know carjacked members and need a

little bit was judging the air spell of ten weeks of summer.

But mine broke in the stratosphere. And they

were I really got logic of.

OK So

you were hired by Percy cropper. When did you begin courses at Easter.

Back this sudden

or are right the first year in that I was with a person who I wrote with birds a grabber no right.

The just almost exactly. Of the eight months and. After

my

commercial. And it

totally after I had my try out quietly.

He said can you be in Philadelphia. Monday night

I have my trial Saturday.

But you'll be in Philadelphia Monday night.

I think so I'll talk to drain from New York.

From brochure. New York to New York so the one change trains and one of the not that

well Springer. Met me at the North Star love your friends took

me across France hours. I got my car. Room the

music and saying that Monday night with the growth in the

region. And then those on my way. I was with them for six or seven

years after that.

OK. And when did you began your birth in Tennessee thought

out the rest. I have my I have my bed. On the

third floor of the primer. But still an interesting

love my companion who have a real.

I'm a third floor of the bookstore. Was. Well

let's leave came from the mood as the.

As a man in bars in the building who say well

who Smith was a principle. Player in the in

the in the Graham Crusade. And so

you began He's during the spring of drought I were in I worked inversion

croppers milling or up

was the first month. That I was there. And on top of thing. Yep.

And that adds to my income a little bit maybe a murder.

Level but was

still very frugal

collide. I'm also worked in the

bookstore. During that time too.

So he

began curses Easter holiday each

unsanitary for him for the next

spot. And that was a four year degree. It was

a combined six here. Th being

big green. Six years. These guys were of our. And

then badger of the eligible bachelor theology and Bachelor of

Arts Bachelor of Arts. But you could

not pick up your busy day after four years. You had to take the hose that he was in

for you could pick up in the group. OK OK. We can do it.

So you get hello when you're walking and he had I go.

One year with a mat and picked up a rock out become a quibble it to

the masses given.

I'm living and doing

what you did seven hears. I did seven years. To have and then. And then a bath or

theology a basket of our that's right. Was it a good education.

Excellent. But it was as if you're all

the same a large include it was struck. A learning. Group.

Can the the go to set it

up in the meantime in ten weeks a year

as that Bible Congress. I heard. New World.

Greatest waggled teachers for tried weeks every

summer. And when I heard an idea. Any names that come to mind

that were if you were boys really and that was done through the room growing

wider hose. My was an intense Presbyterian out there right now.

You LOL you who later.

Who was from Baltimore.

Just everybody who was anybody who went there were others who was a musician.

Ralph Stuart. The when their mother says later her board great numbers

are regular run all of us did he his seven. Was probably one of the most

prolific composers of gospel. Corps is a live in

the one called

up one of two numbers.

The lead less loveless. I thought I saw that name in a lot of

your materials that he maybe showed up. Anyway.

Regardless of

them. So

when you were living in Philadelphia in the midst of all of this. And in

the ninety's and rattling every day. To say less and having

a search and I was stunned when I was on the radio or we have.

So the Brady a public meetings every night of the week by about two weeks. Lease

and sometimes we have one spring where we have forty nine days leading

up read a subject around southern New Jersey or a Pennsylvania.

OK model fifty thousand miles a year. We grab. One hundred thirty nine nine

hundred forty thousand nine hundred forty seven is when you about that about. And

you my gramma. Just by living there and when did you know this is the

way to I met. Graeme Jenny one of only two or left out there. OK.

Still

OK then it's Wednesday June sixteenth two thousand

and five when and continuing interviews with

the purpose of our undoing were picking up women that. In

then he's forty two with the

Delta tell me where you

know. Memorable day.

When her side of it she was there. Right. Well Anderson. There was a. Well.

We had supper together

after the teaching session I

I helped the guys with their Geek. I was better in Greek

and so I I helped them with it a little bit.

As a result of that we finished our studies and had dinner

together there

we talk. Did I study even further

after dinner? I don't think so.

or. That it's getting up my table

You know, she plays the piano.

Why don't you go over to that old pipe organ and

let her play?

Oh, I don't want to.

So I played the piano.

But then you guys are all cleavers and also that you were hurling

nice entertainment news editor you like the music in

the bottles. I was a professional musician.

I think that's the way I worked my way from school.

However is a close them.

Similar indication at the time was screaming middle and

bugger grubber guys think one of the arrangements for Mike to listen to the

pay for the didn't break the law that's a later on the. Well I had to do

was a remark

What's it like. Neither you know

sounding ever worried

about how you cracked the play.

Can I do it is wearing on

the years nineteen

already. The corny seven I guess you did your

brother were there. What are the. In terms of career wise

though I mean that's really I guess we could talk about this period by you

were in Philadelphia. When you move.

How do you think she's playing marbles and

now she went back to school for a mother as you're

all

you know. I've just finished until May and this makes me scared by

was below me and then.

Most definitely right. So she came to Philadelphia. In May of forty

one know Mayor. So it's Hillary.

Forty three doing. Mayor or is doing were married in May Have What were you doing.

But let's go back a ways to

that what you can help me with is writing is challenging.

OK When the hardest thing is separating out the

chronology of major events. So that I have a brain work.

And so the more you can help me do

that in terms of what happened this year what were the major moments

in ships and. Well with each chapter of this story

like sure

that. That's the only one I understand we do not have this time.

So. We met him in. Well you

are out for every wasn't making and about forty

two are probably too. She went back a second ago when

going to Philadelphia. In September. You know the man

may or may or isn't this I was finished. Well I am a

or forty two. Well. We.

And I go down at a stubborn confirm they

are signed by brother and

SIL so I'm sure that close.

It's just that the shared same

ago. OK. So the next is the problem. Run.

Really hot Well how would you describe these years and one when

did you leave that out there one of the ones that section we can talk about we have seventy

years in the SO route once you're done with seminar you did. But I did

that he had seven years and then you move down about of course you are still in they have

him there at the timing this is big and we have what we

have five. OK. And so here here's their involvement. Seminary.

And really course is a main

line. Maryjane there you three forty one three marriages.

For a three residence in

Rock Central and reporting on the radio program pub.

Then what did you do when

you retire. I read some of the rather still don't think. I play. Work

to start a new color. BUT I MADE IT Lee almost

immediately started in. And

the and the concept program.

We that. I stated I was in Delhi with my friends

staying with those couples. So you.

And because there is so say these things so that stays until September.

And

then they still have to give up that help that apartment they were

in agreement lived in never. I that they never

with his human rights records or you know person I was in there buying I was

in the room. We had options. Who thought I was sick really what some are

while. So that was before in the you know

the I don't know where the oh you were living with that guy.

It was given that living with the court that guy. When I met

him Who are you in an apartment.

The three of

you showing rain you. Was a rock for.

I don't know I don't think so I don't think you lived in

that but it just about towards

all than where your three guys were living together at that time. Jim

and Brown was living with this

bear and geography there was another.

Yeah. I don't know it was

a well known important. How would you describe.

And how he forty

seven moved. I would use Fridays years it was busy and you

were essentially in his our family

and you moved. You moved to Melbourne.

No I didn't do it that those two couples the number for the summer.

And then those took up a pen to give up that home.

So I I I'm not going to go to. I moved

in with a girl friend and their parents that I met him. I stayed

the summer there. And then

I had to move in with that. Another girlfriend and her

parents and. I met there. From September.

TO may. When I Get

Married. Some And. What I did was

I route to quite soon put me in the broadcast

booth I saying at

first and then when she had a baby.

A plane. And that broadcast the going around the world.

This little girl. I practiced.

What she did she had a run. Opening the but cast. What's

what I had to come up to him and I practiced and I know that

that was very important to me I had to have that by the top of the

world

never the suburbs were spent a cordon broke. Because

of what was your question of home.

We can use drugs as a bigot

because we have. Percy

rented for three of a couple ten what the Brown Yeah. And

Brown wasn't married at all but I mean in Ray. And

Betty until we were are married or cross a

group in by you but it's hard to

gather the Willows the only ones attack whether or not but

those were good as

well as we did. For one that that kind of weapon we were there. But we moved in that house.

The three couples. Firstly rented that power. And we had a car

that we had they have to

remember. What was your impression

of the camp.

What were that member go for you.

Well I had been. I had been to camp as a kid

my parents went over to say the Bible conference which was a thirty

five miles or so between Buffalo and the Liane. So I was used to

going there but just with my parents I don't think I ever wanted somebody lot more.

Because of the low yeah.

But I I was used to going

to let my parents to the Bible can you know there

was a present for reproach she enjoys the Word of God and

clothe explain to you how you have remeeting the

day. By the best teachers a little world. She just

gobble up one of your both to

about getting just wanted to give her a chance that it was a

formative experience to be exposed to some of the great minds in the

Christian That created by Byron I didn't mention her

earlier sailing. Manship he is one of the

great hurry Ironside has a commentary on every book of the Bible in

her

heart and I wasn't doing person that it was all the room.

Because I thought I'm not a

menace. And then I have to tell you something very

important as the thing today to happen.

But I can't stand the radio. Year two years later and bust

up. And he

sat back their hands sank. When to be with the Lord in the.

And I carbon

minutes back at them I said when I go to bed.

And he said. Right. When I said you'd said Dr thank when we've

lowered in the spirit. So I'm going to go

to him. Now to drop in for the

I want to go and see that lawyer get the straightened out so that those recall

our lows about the joke

or is it that we have been our goal

or

blow them away. And I was so

I didn't do it Brad get us to correct his mistake.

And he finished out.

Any other questions of those years. It sounds like. If anything for me during that that period.

Well it seems like it was a hub of the city is on the

management service there. Remember the rovers. For those in some of the little waiting.

We're waiting for your graduated from seminary before we couldn't make any kind of

like choices. And I felt I'd live. League or were alone.

Every night and guys were gun. So we were very good things and

sure they're good friends we are that gap in Philadelphia where we had

work. When we got married. Our salary got bumped up

the subsea got hours a week which was you. What we were getting.

But I was really into the I knew

what he was the first one to get married. And so you're supposed to be kicked up the courts

at all the it was after one summer. And they did. And now the guy.

Want to there in September. Together to that but Kasten

said. You're going to hire or ever.

Or in about. We are getting

married. You know that the person the other three. We say they were going to

wait and the in UNGAR babe done with their girls them out longer than dad with me.

So.

OK. And. Those of you in the future. Hello.

OK.

Can you tell me about. It seems to one of the things that struck me when I

was looking at the documents from the nineteen eighties from Buffalo Christian Center.

I know I don't. This is my impression. I'm interpeting. So if I'm wrong

please say so. But, I saw Christian show business circuit in the nineteen eighties.

I see all these talent agents. Here is

my talent and these. This circuit. Was there a Christian

show business circuit in the forties when you guys got married that we were

pretty prominent speakers. Bible and then singers

and

competitive as a companion programming growing up as a programming of evangelism.

As a primary early on Saturday nights and

other hand there is a club asserts a room. What

about you might meet losing.

Recording nationally know were courting Argus and presenting them personally.

To the brutal of western New York.

And Monday night or Monday

nights and it might mean one of mocking up Philadelphia right now. Oh.

We met. OK. We're back. I'll quit your job about it isn't the burden that I was

I had that I guess what I'm asking

is in set of me in the forty's. Was there as a what are

you participating or was it just being born. It just seems like.

I know revivalism goes way back. But is it seems

like is is tell if you just took on the Christian part of it that I

was someone might mistake you for a couple who are in

professional entertainment. Except you're marrying you

were drinking and part of those the world know we're all

musical most musical ministry.

Now how

many entertain. Musicians

and speak what what can you describe this world. This.

You know it sounds like when you've read been one of those

biography on a biography. And he talks about well. We were all living together.

Jerry Seinfeld or me and we were beginning. We would have a big here that we.

It sounds of a little like that and I'm trying to rent a lot

of something here that we can capture this. In

one thousand nine hundred forty two forty five or six three

seven. But I was part of a place. But

I LET LET was the way I live

in six days yet my life. How do you know what about is out there.

What how broad is this is a national thing has North America.

Less was wealthy. Except a single in value was doing

is OK with they know what I'm asking is how many other people in

Boston or about are now in land in Chicago.

How big is in their circuit. I mean. It went to church and how

common is this. In this an extension of what you had when you were growing up with

these preachers will come in a town. You never know what is this

world that they're scholars going to be interested in interested in how the

world that you are entering. Which is not just going to be in Pastor

of church that very well known.

But there's something a little bit of a mystery here. Because today. There's a lot of attention paid

to. Kristin entertainers most of the these men these but today.

A popular show South Park with a parody. About if you want to become Thing this.

Get a Christian rock band started first. And there's a whole industry. A

Christian there's a special on him and then. So there's a lot of interest in that today.

And what I'm curious. Is that it is interesting to

me that I'm one level and seems to be an overlap between a Broadway show business.

Lifestyle with backing of the present time. Hot

how many other people like this. Rather like you guys who were part of the

Was there a circuit. Well know what what was how lonely were greatly you

think you kind of that circus

and you're describing. Overcome her. After losing evolution.

Record mark and that's what started there was a

people giving themselves empowerment to just move they're

going to and I was there but it looks pretty tame with me is

that when the big bridge was we knew that they were his trap. It was

a moment. Radio was some regional

travel creasing with every day that when one made on

holiday with a big break every lie down

or well has monsoon I have I'm seeing. Absolutely.

Them they went across the

country and

landed in order the good way

to go other places came as a result of absolute seven

hundred who came were taken back up it's June

seventeenth Thursday. Over the southeast when Tonight does not like it.

Nine twenty five

A.M. And here with Alan Forbes

in chain for just going to John Ensign on Tyler Flynn. And we're

taking up. Talking

about your move to Buffalo New York

to work two years with nine hundred forty seven in one hundred forty

nine but at the Prospect Baptist Church. Yes. Got.

The last time. Maybe we can pick up with this last time we were talking about.

Experience and. I was thinking of every

night. About another phase of the preparation for the work in Buffalo.

As far as my work with the person crockery was concerned. The fact that I visited

so many different churches. One every day. Practically a different

church here on the Jersey Pennsylvania

church. It would be opened by a hymn.

And then the court and Mrs Gropper would take

over twenty twenty five hour surgery

was. Present are more than

Christian entertainment. Which would bet everyone who.

Many teams doing that we were you

make when you think Christian entertainment. You mean saying oh I

don't know I'm going. Presenting a program of very

Or I'll just up front performing whom and I have a

problem. And then.

During the

hears you must be very busy and issuing College and Seminary.

That's right but remember they were warriors. And we were exempt from the

war. Because we were and some of them.

I have always felt that very keenly that we should applaud arms elements

of probably to our work writing one had at one time period

I even had a side job working for a federalist Then

story get married never want to go. So a

typical we. We know with the summer and he was like it was ten we are going to be me. Did they

have a temp a coral week for you than I

was

working at the new day there in a day and you have meetings.

And I hope school what schools are in a have unlimited room. And then about

Clark Luckily at the moment I would have to get the car and we would travel as much

and as much as ninety

miles to the area churches in Pennsylvania and New Jersey.

Well New York where about us we are way it was another

case. So most of your travel was with then

others miles under my belt there.

But then that returning to it man gets less right away. California. Same

legal where

that not but mainly men they came in for those

two hundred to one of the

two miles of Cape during the here is did you

have had did you ever have a. What were

the is how old. Whenever a local story can intersect

with a national map anything. You always want is made those as possible. So hearing about. You

know some He's well known people it helps we are local. So about another here right

behind me. I'm going to quote myself with a lot of them. I Pod

What if you get a personal brand. At Iraq. Heinrich was OK The. The FRONT OF

through it jumps. I became acquainted with a lot of people. Now don't know what are

some quotes of those years. I'ma all men.

And personally

knew making up the people that were here I would lose. And at the

Buffalo Christian

Center. OK OK. Yes. Now you are going to have some of

the names that I've encountered. All of them are from the earlier period. Could

be OK I'm a power like JAMES BENNETT I only have a row.

Because

it I look at Percy cropper. Was he at Pine

Grove how present was he there was he speaking every day all over here

with the order of the old the earth a little

a lot of our muffin. I work with is

personal business.

And so he was a director and a public speaker and didn't get her radio

programs from there let we recognize what actually from

their other localities. The radio program who their. And he did continue to

work there. Or back as you're out we have all a lie.

A level I was but got the brag that the rug gets it over the world. And while you were at home work you

did not travel to churches. Well observed in the equation from that. But this is

a basic cable. There are A quick to murder people that.

Of had something notable aggregate.

And it would be like one set of campers and come through adult. Yes. Came to have to make

about ten children who need I

guess teenagers. Just teenagers. No doubt their parents are with me

on weekend meaning they would come. Sunday.

If they get their kids in stay here. That's right. What

were the. Were there other big moments when you.

In the six years. When he said four or Matt. Really famous

people or

national think that you want to

mention. In the meantime anything now or

I don't think you we went to the depth of my own

house and down. You know Piers it's neither.

We haven't seen them. But maybe other people wouldn't know their

news so we wouldn't

get her back.

Anything else about those

years. Hope.

I'm looking at pictures here hopefully I'll be in the future for these pictures. But look

at

that and the Last night I

was there.

And there was a style of programming. That Mrs Crawford

was probably the originator and I was in later of it

and woman's remember. But what the present day is what's called

the praise music OK.

Which is generational. That praise loser because normally big ten to

fifteen years ago. Run churches turned from having a choir.

To having a group of small a small group of people who shoot

in the church services. That's all maybe ten to fifteen years old.

Prior to that lower

was audience participation in what were called courses in the early part

of church services. And Mrs Crocker.

Single and link of the.

Well the a bridge in the leg or arm all that music. She gathered it

was given to belts public. Yes.

Fifteen separate quarters. Rocks. That people in

churches around. Entire East Coast. Would

you can you give. Can you sing maybe a tune the typical

chorus and a walk with me in the god

with no lights. But. Well I had eyes that had a really tell

you

was do you not know where everyone is when you go out in

the Orlando.

Everybody who landed there. You think is wrong

and now solo. Globe

or idea that everybody

whether. That's right and that angle well. Mr go home.

The composer of that person or a. I mean when

the loveless who was dominant and was by Will that you just mentioned Meryl Dunlop

was another one of

these. There were other quo or perhaps a

dozen cars. ROGERS. Doing that per user although that

payment is a result of. Mrs Crawford but it will show that issue.

And there was this. This is being made to have him around him to come in

with an archive this is very helpful to have. Especially with this

interview. But it was nano music that would have been a great amount really good

news up. And I may not use them again but I'm not really the

most is make sure they come my way with him.

OK. How can you tell me that very helpful. Can you tell

me about. When you graduated from Eastern.

What happened that you had a child born in one thousand forty six and eight. In man

but he had one where you go.

And so very wet eyes looked like she was born in March of one binary thinking

then that for one whole next school year master of

the men in the morrow. And

the fact he actually it was a plea deal at that time.

Dr a dependent. But they are limited and may just be telling that

it became a OK. A Great thousand. Since

it was an extra year. Should class apply as a master which route looms up

in the vision where you should know.

But no could do know that the six train a stick and they said

he would be dying in the back to state where you're going to bury him. When we've

been married a couple of years. Do we leave the premises or no but maybe he

said. No I don't think we do it has nothing to do with the advance of them but

they didn't expect him to. And Dr I

was mean that was during these years OK. You must remember.

Without being him out of the big hole where we were

who we were doing was celebrating staggers

status within the church community.

Because of the radio. And because of that short amount of travelling that. And

how many job or all of the old regime of there was so that had left the

same impact on people. And I was told regime. Artists

were the pack of being on the radio.

Specially machinable radio. Make you a celebrity.

Do you want to talk about that.

No this is where we were so I know where you have very like what did you think of that. You know

what I think

the in the only answer and then to my parents.

We. They could hear the back can hear it.

And they came to but

somehow they came to buckled to

the same. And now to secure comes not America here's

a pragmatic approach New Year clean.

And I heard that but then that train had who they were and out on a

little stand that they came to this big of a Tory

and that we have shown you know that we. That he came was

perfectly there that's when he met my parents they came tumbling into Buffalo to

meet him. And I was living in Philly but I

came to Buffalo. So that he couldn't live

there. If we could cause.

How did you feel about being part of a celebrity culture.

And having that would

depend on how you can scan in there who didn't know

I got a square are ordinary and

the I get sentenced except for then I've been thinking a

lot about it but this to me at least the thing

I regret. You know I have

made for cuts and what year was that happened

that

I was running through all her her problems on

the boards was in

the makeup. So you were saying even if you

began with a

certain remember. Sure. Did you begin to attract attention as

your

own single put

me as a solo on that it broadcast travel here on the radio.

You know about her was when than if you found

out I could play.

And then when she had a baby.

I was no baby it was

and to play in America and around

the

world in the burbs

can't wear the same be.

The the basin is in you know Ecuador. Which we went and we're

down later. For my and you know what respect the mission went

away. To make him. We went there and we're going

to and that space and

still it can be very good read. Center everything everywhere. That was much later.

Mostly. But did you see any potential. This

year of you see any potential. What were the benefits of this much attention

and were there any drought that

when the contracts that I met with people that I could use

later

in the movie. I work in the work at

the

center also influenced my decision must have been

part of a national group in Ruston in the archives where

you knew when the but the

churches were independent churches.

Hesitancy to be attached to everything that was national or international they

would rise the national the when one of the many of

the Wonder Dog growing national figures.

But no you were wrong and that is anybody. And

Bob peers.

Run the press and that is their crime and. We went to trial. And you said

to him. You know I I am. Whim of your organization but I

don't need to because I know being people personally and used to cry.

The board. What for our best city in the United

States too because they move the speaker in new concepts out in

the

mail on a billion from the only organization which I didn't use a lot.

And yeah I had the contact or and they know. We were good friends with them with

no problem but that one Billy Graham with them and welfare

and get her out through and bought him. And who are.

The president

early Johnson who was part of the greater worry.

Ground in count. The the fellow who within that.

He was a crack and dad went into Iraq and went. Met them

and second no I'm not adding anything to you but I don't need to

do their work. Not

only that when I was melt into the radio Mother Bab but I felt that the churches

would resent being the problem. I would not have those uproar.

When my vocal charges if I were the sons you needed to a massive organization.

And good the we didn't need it you know. And so it's money in the so then

they come back

a celebrity and have this attention that you receive because your radio. Figures.

You helped one of the positives it gave you your own set your own

Rolodex OK. I was from a personal contacts for me here. He see any

problem with with this amount of attention. And the celebrity culture.

Well.

I only say that I don't know why I mention that except

that. I really know the others. By

the other over emphasized in the movie. For the person.

That's not the rule or the simply for the night. When I

was with person crap. I love or went to a church that wasn't

bought with the five dollar governments and

then in the Red Sox the I'm going to be in. But were told You can

be sure of this is what I mean all the

ground and will learn when people tell in this world that I was a perfect

robber was barely come to have absolutely New Jersey

in the church was

full and the going have to or we went contact with Jack

work that went out on a little move out if wife were paid down

there personally and then Jack became a good friend of F.E.M.A. to Rep

It can't kill them in a parallel around

the

world where I live.

Or another what it was at that looked at. And

so then we went there I went there plain perma in to do you know

that you know one of those you know it works and son.

Can't think the same question was witness to my

music. And we're good friends but when he was going to move to that says he

called us and back peepin down the way down here was down with

some wonderful musician loads of music. And we're good friends.

As we were with by

the. Can Really can you walk me through your your transition

out of seminarians where good up with the you know most of the

time when bucks. Not all runs from Mitchell's

group. I'm alone with

her classroom I'm in first

year of our marriage with one comeback story. You did the same.

Several conditions were just one. But Napa same probably closer closer.

You sound just the season. Yeah. It was for them. I would if I

was military chaplain I could come back with another person or what will be a couple of streets

from a couple of streets

from the. Well not. You

know something else that important that out this summer we got married.

What Allen had to leave the court that they had another panic come in because you couldn't get a binder.

Because even where and everyone ran the books. So our work and

pretty books that are going to this that a princess.