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Christian Berg, "Pilgrimage."
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- speakerAnd when they
- speakerthis is The World Refugee year and in connection with the world
- speakerrefugee year the National Council of Churches is participating
- speakerthrough the Church World Service in work having to do with
- speakerrelief, with relief of refugees. Today we have
- speakerDr. Berg Dr. Berg BERG the leader of the church
- speakerrelief work organization here in West Germany. Here in West
- speakerBerlin I should say. But his clients, the people he looks out for, are
- speakerfrom East Germany. I was going to ask him a number of questions about his
- speakerwork. And first of all Dr. Berg could you tell us what
- speakeris this organization at which you are the head.
- speakerYes I should say our church organized relief work
- speakersince the end of the war, takes care for the
- speakerpeople in need and, in the same way, Christ who
- speakerstrengthens the church after a terrible war to come
- speakerto a new life and to bear wittness. So
- speakerit's clear that West Berlin is an important
- speakerpoint because you can walk from here in the
- speakersame way to East and West Germany on both sides of
- speakerthe Iron Curtain. We have the big task
- speakerto strengthen the church behind the Iron Curtain. You shouldn't
- speakerforget that this area is the origin country of the Reformation,
- speakerthe heart of the Reformation. If I call the names of Wittenberg
- speakerand Eisenach was about Barak, Leipsig and Magdeburg
- speakerand other places and who where the Moravians had their
- speakerorigin place. So you will understand what it
- speakermeans that 50 millions of Protestants behind the Iron Curtin, in the today. Eastern Germany look for the help of their
- speakerbrethren Firstly in western Germany but in the
- speakerwhole ecumenical world.
- speakerAnd of course in the same way since the last
- speakerten or 14 years West-Berlin has become an important
- speakerpoint for the whole refugee problem
- speakerwhat you mentioned in the beginning. Now what is the function of
- speakerthe church? It is an evangelical Protestant church it is the Lutheran church, is it
- speakernot, that you belong to? That's
- speakera complicated matter Sir and not easy to understand for an American.
- speakerOf course it's almost Lutheran, a Lutheran church,
- speakerbut there are some Reformed congregations. And in
- speakerthe whole we call it the Evangelical Church of Germany
- speakerdivided in several regional churches.
- speakerAnd, what are their functions in connection with these refugees? How do you work as a
- speakerchurch body with these refugees and with the governments involved? zoneMay
- speakerI say some more words about the
- speakerorigin of this tragedy. You know that 45- 46,
- speakerafter the war
- speakerabout 30 millions of people moved from the
- speakereastern parts of Germany in the last
- speakerfour zones. So, And West Germany came about
- speaker9 million refugees. And in the today eastern part of
- speakerGermany, the so-called German Democratic Republic of the east zone,
- speakerfour and a quarter millions of refugees now four and a quarter million
- speakerrefugees came into East Germany from other countries from East Prussia, Silesia, East Pomerania, Bohemia and these countries
- speakernow in Czechoslovakia or Poland or what ever places
- speakerthey are.
- speakerThe rules are that was right after the war.
- speakerYes but in the same time it began
- speakerthe move of the population of today Eastern
- speakerGermany in western direction in the average
- speakera quarter of million every year. So that's the eastern zone of
- speakerGermany lost in the last 30 years
- speakerabout three and a quarter million of refugees. three and a quarter million
- speakerrefugees from East Germany to West Germany. And then there was before that about
- speaker9 million you say came to West Germany from other parts of Germany and Europe.
- speakerI see that now then. Now if we could get onto how about these
- speakerpeople who who who come across the border, who are they?
- speakerThey are all different kinds and groups of
- speakerpopulation.
- speakerMedical doctors, lawyers, teachers, peasants
- speakerfactory owners and mainly young people.
- speakerSo that's a percentage of the young population is
- speakervery very high. The reasons are very different.
- speakerSome is personal danger and difficulties in an
- speakereconomical life. There are other reasons that the families don't see
- speakera future for their young people if they are not aetheistic or
- speakersocialistic minded in the ideology in that
- speakerarea. There are good reasons and
- speakerother reasons which we have to understand.
- speakerIn any case for the church too, not only for the
- speakerpeople as a whole, it is a big problem and a
- speakertragedy that hundreds of thousands
- speakerof people go away from our 8000
- speakerchurch congregations in the east zone and they lose very
- speakeroften most valuable people for the work which the
- speakercongregation has to do in that area. I hope you will agree
- speakerwith my my basic point that a Christian church
- speakershould be also in a communist ruled country that the witness of
- speakerour Lord Jesus Christ should be preached
- speakerand lived also in the circumstances which we
- speakerpolitical spoken don't like as
- speakerpeople in a free country in a free country.
- speakerSo the difficulties that these people confront in East Germany is a
- speakerchallenge to the best elements in the Christian tradition. It
- speakertakes the pressure and troubles of that life to bring out the finest
- speakerChristian qualities.
- speakerI am glad that you asked so sir.
- speakerBecause the main task in our work is to
- speakerstrengthen that church in that
- speakercircumstances to help them to
- speakerhear the challenge of our Lord and to give that challenge to the
- speakerpeople in that area.
- speakerSo we try to build a new churches
- speakerto train the young people for the service in the church to help the needy
- speakerpeople, the sick people, the old people, the children. We feed
- speakerthem in years before.
- speakerIn times of need with help
- speakeralso and especially from your country, as we are very glad to
- speakerhave friends since years and as a Lutheran and Reformed and
- speakerPresbyterian congregations and churches in your
- speakercountry. But that all means that we where
- speakerwe can try to hinder the people to flee and to stay
- speakeras Christians in that area where Martin Luther called it the real gospel on a biblical basis
- speakeras we
- speakermean and we understand.
- speakerBut how about these ones who have come across, who have not stayed for a
- speakervariety of reasons? For example, you mentioned I think earlier that some of them don't have any chance
- speakerat a higher education unless they accept the communist philosophy. Of course. You
- speakerknow that is a fact.
- speakerThe government of the German Federal Republic and its representatives here in West Berlin
- speakertake care by law for these people.
- speakerAfter some weeks in the refugee camp they have the chance to come to
- speakerWest Germany and to find a new existence. If you
- speakerremember remember this number of more than 3
- speakermillions of refugees after the war then you will understand
- speakerthat in West Germany there is a race between the coming refugees
- speakerand to find jobs and working places and to build
- speakerhouses for these refugees. So that we have up to now a
- speakersituation that hundreds of thousands are still in camps.
- speakerBut it's astonishing in how many
- speakerdirections the government and community authorities
- speakertake care of these refugees. And, the Church and the
- speakercongregations have a lot to do with that, taking care
- speakerfor the new families for the young people to
- speakerhelp them over that point that they lost their home in East
- speakerGermany. I can understand that very well because we
- speakerare a big family and five of us brothers and
- speakersisters are living in West Germany, three still in East Germany, and I
- speakermyself here on the border in that famous West Berlin.
- speakerSo we understand these hundreds of thousands of
- speakerfamilies which are divided in these both parts of
- speakerGermany with a very different way of life in their
- speakerwhole understanding and ideology.
- speakerWell now you spoke of they are part of the German the West German government is playing in this. at Your
- speakerchurch relief organization doesn't, of course, handle all the refugees who come
- speakeracross. How do how do they how do certain refugees come to be handled by you? How does that work
- speakerout?
- speakerYou know that is the East German government
- speakermade a law last year forbidding any refuge.
- speakerIt's a tremendous problem for the state of Mr. Ulbricht [Ulbricht, Walter, Prime Minister, 1950-1971] and Mr. Grotewohl [Grotewohl, Otto, Prime Minister, 1946-1950]
- speakerbecause it may be the only state in the world
- speakerwith a declining instead of a growing population.
- speakerAnd since the refuge is strictly forbidden. The
- speakerbigger part of the refugee streams comes over West Berlin
- speakeras a point where they can reach
- speakerthe so-called free world. The church
- speakeroffers their help--relief work, pastoral
- speakercare. We send in refugee camps our
- speakerpastors preaching and calling the congregations
- speakerunder the word of God during these
- speakerweeks four weeks eight weeks where they have
- speakerlost their home and don't know their new home in West Germany
- speakeror if they want to emigrate in Canada, or the United States, Australia or where
- speakerever. So we try every refugee
- speakerto offer help and the assistance of that
- speakerchurch. And now, Doctor Berg, could
- speakeryou tell us a little something about the attitude of these East
- speakerGermans as they come into West Germany. I know it must be difficult to generalize, but
- speakercould you give any idea of? Do most of them find that they settle down
- speakerhere and find a place for themselves? Is there homesickness, disappointment? How
- speakerabout the West Germans? How do they receive this continuing flow? Of
- speakercourse, in one line it's
- speakereasier for these refugees compared
- speakerwith refugees from Hungary or Czechoslovakia or wherever in the
- speakerworld, because they come to brothers and sisters from one people, where the
- speakersame language and the same way of life is
- speakerstill found.
- speakerSo almost the people
- speakerwhich comes to West Germany find by and by walking places finds
- speakertheir homes and so on.
- speakerOn the other hand you shouldn't be astonished if the West
- speakerGerman population is longing for the
- speakerend of this continuing stream of
- speakerevery year every month every week new coming
- speakerrefugees in their area. Every day! every day
- speakerof course if the planes are going regularly from Berlin
- speakerand bring their burden to Kassel and Frankfurt and Stuttgart and Hamburg
- speakerto Munchen and Dusseldorf. And, it averages out at about
- speaker400 every day, does it not, Doctor Berg? I would
- speakerthink so if you think
- speaker250000 people in the average and
- speakeryou think that this year the number will be
- speakerdeclining.
- speakerSo if we are number 1
- speaker50 to 200000 this year then you have
- speakera number of 400 average every day.
- speakerWell now in this 400 a day that is pouring in now isn't a very
- speakerlarge proportion of that number. Doesn't it consist of East Germans who have
- speakerpersonal connections relatives friends with whom they are directly in touch? So they're
- speakernot just going into an unknown place unknown land.
- speakerOf course that's a different time as Switzerland was divided
- speakerin the 15th century from the so-called
- speakerreich in this time the German population
- speakerthrough the war and at times after that war
- speakeris mixed in the manifold
- speakerways.
- speakerSo think of my family if I wasn't hope
- speakerthat one of my relatives would go any day to West Germany
- speakerthe sister or brother in law would find his
- speakerrelatives and his friends and it's always hundreds and thousands perhaps was a
- speakerbigger part of refugees.
- speakerBut I think back on the point I stress as the
- speakermost important. We in the church think on these people
- speakeras a lose for their congregations in
- speakerthe eastern part of Germany in couples. A loss to the congregation?
- speakerOf course there are people as laymen
- speakerworking in the congregation
- speakerperhaps serving with the pastor in the
- speakercongregation. I think on my last visit in the United States I came to
- speakera pastor in Iowa in a very rural congregation. And,
- speakerhe told me that in the last year he lost about 50 members
- speakerof his congregation and 300 people going into the
- speakersuburbs of Chicago and Detroit.
- speakerAnd you know, the development in your country-- all the suburbs are growing and the
- speakerrural area declines in their population.
- speakerSo your people in the United States may fear
- speakerwith the pastor with a congregation with a church body in Leipsig or Dresden, if they hear
- speakerweek by week. This family has gone.
- speakerThis man has decided to leave
- speakerour city and our congregation and go to West Germany. It is a hard thing.
- speakerAnd we have to pray and to
- speakerthink and to help that these congregations remain
- speakerreally Christian congregations that they can give their witness
- speakerin a world which needs the message of our Lord as a
- speakerreal redeemer of our world.
- speakerWell now, Dr. Berg, how about the people in East Germany, either those who go or
- speakerstay. To what extent are they changed, influenced,
- speakerby the ideology by the political doctrines and
- speakerteachings of the communists? Are they making headway? The Communists with their doctrine, as
- speakeragainst the Christian doctrine, among the peoples of East Germany?
- speakerThat's very hard to answer on that question. You have to think on
- speakerdifferent points for that. And I would
- speakerremind you that this country your rich countries the
- speakerheart of the Protestant Germany has become in the last
- speakercentury very weak in the church life. And, there are many people
- speakerofficially depending and connected with the congregations
- speakerwhich is in their minds and in their spirits
- speakervery far away from the real sender of the Gospel
- speakerwith people the permanent coming
- speakercommunist ideology with all that what they offer
- speakerin the daily life.
- speakerSo they have perhaps not so difficult to
- speakerwin any people for their thinking and their
- speakerideology. So, be not astonished if I say say
- speakerit is a growing part of the population who goes to the
- speakerdedications of the communist ideology. A part who doesn't think that they lose
- speakerreally if they are divided from the
- speakerChurch and the young people. The
- speakernow situation and was now 13 years
- speakeryoung girl or boy three four years after
- speakerthe time of Hitler was a very difficult time for the
- speakerchurch that knows earlier times. So
- speakerwe have to look forward to new new forms
- speakerand new ways to preach the Gospel and to
- speakerfill in the hearts understanding of the Gospel a new
- speakerway.
- speakerWell now what happens to these refugees when they arrive in the West Zone?
- speakerHow are they financed? How are they helped? How is it possible to carry all this burden?
- speakerWest German government has a lot of laws
- speakerwhich offers help to different occupations of the people
- speakerthe working people is offered a working place in the
- speakerindustry. They get loans.
- speakerThey get help for finding a house and home. The
- speakeryoung people are sponsored in with the things that
- speakerschools are some places if they learn something.
- speakerIn any case it's astonishing what West Germany can do
- speakerand does and tries to do for the people of the same people
- speakercoming from behind the Iron Curtain.
- speakerHow about help from outside? Well you know
- speakervery thankfully that the world outside especially our
- speakerbrother churches all of these here are thinking
- speakerhow to help these people in different ways.
- speakerFirstly we know that for people
- speakerfrom other countries.
- speakerBut we are thankful for the different ways of help.
- speakerThank you very much, Dr.
- speakerBerg